Advices needed for my first crash, Video included. - Page 2 - 600RR.net
Riding tips A good place to gain &, share knowledge , information and tips about safe enjoyable riding .

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #31 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 04:15 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
redrr308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: washington mo
Posts: 541
Images: 4
Thanks: 6
Thanked 52 Times in 45 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Lol ur fine... Ya use my knee as a gauge. As it touches its a holy sht am i crashin oh wait its supposed to do that.
redrr308 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 04:22 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
jimpaine1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 754
Thanks: 7
Thanked 67 Times in 47 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
^ look at you starting off the second page on top lol

Team Orange
jimpaine1 is offline  
post #33 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 01:49 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
redrr308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: washington mo
Posts: 541
Images: 4
Thanks: 6
Thanked 52 Times in 45 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Id like to thank everyone behind me i couldnt have done it without them. Wanna thank honda for giving me such an amazing machine and tacobell for keeping me full with those late night meals and htc for deriving such a magical black rectangle. Like i said couldnt do this alone.
redrr308 is offline  
post #34 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 01:56 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
jimpaine1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 754
Thanks: 7
Thanked 67 Times in 47 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Congrats to you now back to work! lol

Team Orange
jimpaine1 is offline  
post #35 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 02:07 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
salsaleh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,113
Thanks: 34
Thanked 114 Times in 85 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
you were going too slow to be leaning that much


Your daily dose of pre-workout motivation, fitness articles, and whatever it takes to go beast-mode on em

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Painan...40363356065027
salsaleh is offline  
post #36 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 05:52 PM
Knee Dragger
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 112
Thanks: 3
Thanked 33 Times in 20 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by 365RR View Post
what is the point of doing anything? For example asking this question. This is deep, man......



Well, that the point gets interesting and puzzles me,
1. I honestly think I didnt push the handle bar by any means in the mid-turn or did any steering corrections.
2. "Adding throttle and lean angle at the same time is one of the leading causes of lowsides." I think this will cause lowside because of losing the back end. not in my case the front end.
3. During turning, some say I should ease my arms on the tank when turning, and put my weight on the foot pegs, and you say I should keep constant pressure on the handle bar, which in my view is a little contradicting. the way I feel I am doing right now is your way. and when I trying to lean, I feel I dont have enough leverage to keep the a constant pressure for counter-steering during my turn. I know I must sort out my BP issue first tho.
1. There are clearly steering inputs being made, you can see it in your video. Sometimes it doesn't feel like you are actually putting input into the bars but just the simple act of tensing up or being too tight on either one of the bars can cause it to wiggle.
2. Adding throttle and lean angle at the same time can cause you to lowside by losing the rear end OR tucking the front. Basically you lean the bike over too far for the tires to maintain traction. It is more common to lose the rear end if you give it too much gas while leaning.
3.I never said you should keep constant pressure on the inside handlebar, I asked you if "need to continue to keep pressure on the inside bar throughout the entire turn or can you press on the bar, get the bike to the lean angle you want and then release the pressure while you begin to roll on the gas?"

The correct answer is that you should put ONE input into the handlebar to get the bike at the lean angle you want, then release all pressure and just roll on the gas. the bike will maintain the same line (provided you have good throttle control) until you countersteer OUT of the turn.

It looks to me like you were continually pressing on that inside bar throughout the entire turn (maybe in hopes of getting your knee down). That in combination with your body position caused you to simply lean over TOO far for the front tire to maintain traction and down you went.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swan-rr5 View Post
your weight should be off the bars, but constant pressure should be used to keep the bike on that line, what misti means is once you've made your steering input & put the bike into the turn, you should keep the bars in that position til you're ready to stand the bike up on exit, one steering input maintained with pressure on the bar, not weight on the bars. your weight should be held with your legs & core muscles.
Actually what I mean is that you countersteer into the turn and once you are at the lean angle you want then you STOP PRESSING either bar. Your arms can relax and you don't need to keep constant pressure in order to hold the bike on that line. Provided you have good throttle control the bike will maintain that line until you counter-steer out.

Misti
misti hurst is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to misti hurst For This Useful Post:
swan-rr5 (11-07-2012), TribalCBR06 (11-06-2012)
post #37 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-06-2012, 10:58 PM
Moto GP Racer
 
TribalCBR06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Central FL
Posts: 10,277
Images: 13
Thanks: 245
Thanked 149 Times in 138 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Good discussion. Misti and Swan made some excellent points.

I see it like this: your hands should be pretty light on the bars during the turn. As mentioned before your feet and legs should be holding most of your weight, not your arms. For example, on a left curve/lean you should be able to let go of your left hand on the left clipon; which is why you sometimes see experienced riders touch the ground mid-lean.

Your right hand should be smooth with throttle inputs. Any adjustments you need to make mid-turn should be done by adding or decreasing lean of your bike and body along with proper throttle/brakes. Any jerking or wrong adjustment of the handle bars can cause you to crash.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 365RR View Post
something to add.

I checked my front tyre, it is very obvious the area of the left side of the front tyre has been used more than the right side. Another sign of over leaning in the hairpin?
Possibly. I still have about 1/4inch of chicken strips (Mmm chicken!) on both sides of my front tires. What you should be focusing more is body position, not getting rid of your strips or dragging knee. If you have no more chicken strips, then you're at the edge of runing out of traction! Its that simple.

I also didn't even drag knee til my 3rd trackday--but I focused on being smooth and getting the proper line--not dragging knee. That will come with proper technique, do not force it!

In short: It is not a goal, but a result of proper technique.

* * 600RR Ex-Track Junkie * *
Current bike - Yamaha Liquid Silver R1


- Competition Breeds Excellence -

Last edited by TribalCBR06; 11-06-2012 at 11:02 PM.
TribalCBR06 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to TribalCBR06 For This Useful Post:
swan-rr5 (11-07-2012)
post #38 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-07-2012, 01:45 AM Thread Starter
Training Wheel Hero
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 16
Thanks: 10
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Wow, page 2 already. The rumour is true: You meet the nicest people on a Honda. I really appreciates everyone's input, Thank you.

I thought chicken stripe on front is not avoidable. lol...the chicken stripes on my rear tyre are long gone, maybe the first weekend when I got the this bike? getting rid of the chicken stripe was never my aim.. the knee down is. lol....
I wish I can do a proper knee down on my 3rd track day as well. but being more careful tho...lol....lesson learnt.

Since everyone is so encouraging and informative, I just uploaded another video on my cornering on that day as well. Thats the session after my lowside in the 1st session. My friend is nice enough to follow me for few laps.

Any suggestion and advice is welcome both for me and my friend, for example, my bad body position as it has been established in this post, my line on the track, speed on the corners?
Thank you in advance.


Last edited by 365RR; 11-07-2012 at 01:48 AM.
365RR is offline  
post #39 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-07-2012, 02:57 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
swan-rr5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Scotland
Posts: 1,430
Thanks: 155
Thanked 322 Times in 265 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by misti hurst View Post
Actually what I mean is that you countersteer into the turn and once you are at the lean angle you want then you STOP PRESSING either bar. Your arms can relax and you don't need to keep constant pressure in order to hold the bike on that line. Provided you have good throttle control the bike will maintain that line until you counter-steer out.

Misti
my apologies misti, I interepreted what you said as something different, I imagined it as "apply just enough pressure to maintain the bars in that position", like finger-tip light kind of pressure. but yes definetely relaxed arms in the turns

Quote:
Originally Posted by TribalCBR06 View Post
Possibly. I still have about 1/4inch of chicken strips (Mmm chicken!) on both sides of my front tires. What you should be focusing more is body position, not getting rid of your strips or dragging knee. If you have no more chicken strips, then you're at the edge of runing out of traction! Its that simple.

I also didn't even drag knee til my 3rd trackday--but I focused on being smooth and getting the proper line--not dragging knee. That will come with proper technique, do not force it!

In short: It is not a goal, but a result of proper technique.
truth! if you have proper BP you'll be leaning less & have more grip because you'll be on a fatter part of the tyre, so in actual fact your chicken strips may actually get bigger when you first crack the BP

Quote:
Originally Posted by 365RR View Post
Wow, page 2 already. The rumour is true: You meet the nicest people on a Honda. I really appreciates everyone's input, Thank you.

I thought chicken stripe on front is not avoidable. lol...the chicken stripes on my rear tyre are long gone, maybe the first weekend when I got the this bike? getting rid of the chicken stripe was never my aim.. the knee down is. lol....
I wish I can do a proper knee down on my 3rd track day as well. but being more careful tho...lol....lesson learnt.

Since everyone is so encouraging and informative, I just uploaded another video on my cornering on that day as well. Thats the session after my lowside in the 1st session. My friend is nice enough to follow me for few laps.

Any suggestion and advice is welcome both for me and my friend, for example, my bad body position as it has been established in this post, my line on the track, speed on the corners?
Thank you in advance.

http://youtu.be/UGw5OZArImQ
you're still very central on the bike, you're still sitting on the seat in the turns, but if this video was the same day then its understandable.

I found the pics I took while practicing, I PM'd a mod about possibly being allowed to make a "how to fix body position thread" with pics & getting everyones input, but I haven't heard back yet
swan-rr5 is offline  
Old 11-07-2012, 07:33 AM
brmoore
This message has been deleted by Moeman. Reason: Spam and/or unwanted content
post #40 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-07-2012, 01:15 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
redrr308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: washington mo
Posts: 541
Images: 4
Thanks: 6
Thanked 52 Times in 45 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Good second video u can really see u being upright and pretty centered on the bike. Get off and make sure up upper body follow. And get ur upper body and head down. I promise Itll feel so goofy. Does ur track organization have a photographer? If so I always buy my pics just to see what I need to fix.
redrr308 is offline  
post #41 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-08-2012, 11:11 AM
Moto GP Racer
 
crashkhanman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Charlotte, NC 28217
Posts: 3,967
Thanks: 449
Thanked 328 Times in 283 Posts
Feedback Score: 9 reviews
In the 2nd video, you are not looking far enough ahead. This will cause you not to find a fluid line and you'll want to make a lot of changes mid turn. (twitchy)

Relax your grip and upper body while bringing your head down and body closer to the tank.

'07 CBR600RR Track-Only Demon!
Nesba/N2/PRE/TPM/Roger Lyle "A" Group // CCS #306

'08 GSXR 600 Blue ~ Current Bike
'07 Yamaha R6 Blue ~ SOLD
'08 CBR600RR Silver ~ SOLD
'06 Yamaha R6 Black ~ SOLD
'08 GSXR 600 TrackOnly ~ SOLD
'08 GSXR 600 White ~ SOLD
'08 Yamaha R6 ~ SOLD
'07 GSXR 750 ~ SOLD
'12 Aprilia RSV4 Factory ~ Crashed/SOLD
'07 CBR600RR Black ~ SOLD
'09 CBR600RR Phoenix TrackOnly ~SOLD
'09 CBR600RR Red/Black ~SOLD
'07 CBR600RR Blue/Silver ~SOLD
crashkhanman is offline  
post #42 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-08-2012, 04:34 PM
Knee Dragger
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 112
Thanks: 3
Thanked 33 Times in 20 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by swan-rr5 View Post
my apologies misti, I interepreted what you said as something different, I imagined it as "apply just enough pressure to maintain the bars in that position", like finger-tip light kind of pressure. but yes definetely relaxed arms in the turns
No problem! Just wanted to clarify that once the bike is at the lean angle you want you don't need to keep pressure on the bar to hold it in the turn. As someone else mentioned that is why some pro's or coaches for that matter can take their inside hand off the bars and still maintain their line while rolling on the gas :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 365RR View Post
Wow, page 2 already. The rumour is true: You meet the nicest people on a Honda. I really appreciates everyone's input, Thank you.

I thought chicken stripe on front is not avoidable. lol...the chicken stripes on my rear tyre are long gone, maybe the first weekend when I got the this bike? getting rid of the chicken stripe was never my aim.. the knee down is. lol....
I wish I can do a proper knee down on my 3rd track day as well. but being more careful tho...lol....lesson learnt.

Since everyone is so encouraging and informative, I just uploaded another video on my cornering on that day as well. Thats the session after my lowside in the 1st session. My friend is nice enough to follow me for few laps.

Any suggestion and advice is welcome both for me and my friend, for example, my bad body position as it has been established in this post, my line on the track, speed on the corners?
Thank you in advance.

http://youtu.be/UGw5OZArImQ
My suggestion to you is that you take ONE thing at a time and work on it otherwise you will be trying to do too many things at once. For sure your body position needs work but in the second video I still see the same error of adding lean angle and throttle at the same time and that is very dangerous. If you keep that up you will find yourself on the ground again in no time.

That being said, with the different angle of the video, this time having someone follow you, I can really see the reason why you are making a second steering input in the bars and leaning the bike over MORE as you are rolling on the gas.

Take a look at WHERE you are turning the bike in relation to your friend. What happens if you turn the bike too early or too far to the inside of the turn? What is that going to do to your line?

Misti
misti hurst is offline  
post #43 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-14-2012, 07:41 AM
Training Wheel Hero
 
yoyo89833's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 34
Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
friendly suggestion : dont get obsessed about lean angle and knee down, work on ur lines and body position first, and speed, lean angle and knee down wil come naturally.

http://ppt.cc/M0Go@.jpg
yoyo89833 is offline  
post #44 of 44 (permalink) Old 11-14-2012, 10:49 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
dsp jaggar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: san diego
Posts: 868
Thanks: 23
Thanked 60 Times in 49 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimpaine1 View Post
If I can add. Your knee down is a cool feeling, but once you get it there you are actually, from that point on, just trying to keep your knee from touching. You want it to barely scrape and then you pull your leg up a bit like you just hit a cactus. Your using your knee as a little feeler tenticale of where you are on your bike. Does that make sense or am I talking out of my arse??

this is both a good and bad thing. while i agree to a degree, it can also be a bad thing if you are at or near the limit of lean and you pick your knee up it can lead to lowsides

ex:
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMGX9665.jpg
Views:	31
Size:	83.2 KB
ID:	30780 knee down

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMGX9667.jpg
Views:	28
Size:	84.4 KB
ID:	30781knee up

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMGX9674.jpg
Views:	31
Size:	81.6 KB
ID:	30782rider down

while as a whole i agree with the statement just wanted to put another scenerio out there
dsp jaggar is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the 600RR.net forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome