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Old 11-04-2012, 11:54 PM   #1
sameh90
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Question surprises at 80mph corners

So 5 days into riding and i am picking up confidence quite quick..however i am beginning to worry about overdoing it and crashing myself to death. So where and how can you practice dealing with that surprise sand pile on moderate-high speed bends?

I know trackdays aren't really a good choice because acting wierdly halfway through track corners is a no-no with other experienced riders on your tail.

There is a well-lit 3 mile backroad leading to a dead-end nearby that i've use to practice 80-90 mph cornering (i think 130 is possible but ...one step at a time :) ). Road is generally bent to one side with sub-bends so generally you can always see oncoming traffic ~1 mile down the road.

So what kind of maneuvers can i do to prepare myself for cornering surprises (bringing up bike and hard brakes in such situtations didn't work good for me..ended up off-road twice)
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Old 11-05-2012, 12:32 AM   #2
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I'd have to say you would kill yourself pretty fast cornering at 90mph, 5 days into riding. You ended up off road because there will never be enough room for you to brake at 90mph in a corner on public roads. Even if you see any surprise into the corner, you won't be able to react at that speed.
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Old 11-05-2012, 12:39 AM   #3
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Ehh don't practice too much on the streets. The streets will surprise you, the best riders know that. You can't predict the conditions of the road. Even an unexpected bump can throw your suspension off causing a crash. It takes a lot of skill to properly control a bike. It can't be learned in a couple of days or a couple of years or a lifetime. You never really stop learning.

And track days are made for newbs! Instructors, classes, the works :). Going to the track is the best thing you can do man.


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Old 11-05-2012, 01:18 AM   #4
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rather practice slowing down for turns. stick to the speed limit, then slow down. practicing stability and technique at safe speeds is more important than practicing street racing. youve been offraod twice which tells you you are riding outside your limits and its just a matter of time before you kill yourself or others.

slow down or go to a track please
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Old 11-05-2012, 01:29 AM   #5
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last time i checked speed limit is 65, and 75 on some highways.
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Old 11-05-2012, 02:02 AM   #6
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i understand your concern but this stretch of road is literally abandoned..maybe a car or 2 every hour or less (which in any case will be visible miles away).... the road is level, well paved (0 pot-holes, 0 gravel -- no nothing..not to mention i cruise around it slowly first evertime scanning for hazards) and wide (can fit 4 f150's side by side). I only ended offroad (also just few feet off the pavement, with the bike upright --no falls) when i decided to bring it up and brake harshly for no reason but to test how i will cope with emergencies.. I am asking what is a good practice to prepare for sudden swerves or harsh brakes. no tracks nearby, not to mention at track you plan every corner and go with the flow..doesn't really prepare you for sudden swerves.
plus most of these bends are so wide that prolly an isle of man TT racer would take them at 160 mph.. 90 on them is possible without flooring down the chicken stripes ..feels very far from the limit. I am still hesistant around traffic I take a side and constantly avoid being around cars..it's not street racing I am mentioning here.. think of it as a private track.

P.S. I am not completely new to 2 wheelers, i owned a 50cc and 90cc scooters (both impounded) as a teenager both of which i could wheelie..but i don't think that really counts as I am discovering.

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Old 11-05-2012, 02:29 AM   #7
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There's plenty of time to learn, do not learn everything in one week.

It's cool you want to practice, just don't go too aggressive. Not sure what to recommend.
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:00 AM   #8
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The track is exactly what I think would help you. Safer environment with trained instructors to help you out.
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:26 AM   #9
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no offense but being able to wheelie a 50cc scooter doesn't mean you can handle a 600cc sportbike at high speeds. I get that you like the thrill of cornering fast but thats what tracks are for, riding on the street you always have to give yourself a way out of situations, situations that WILL happen even on an abandoned road. say you take a corner at 90mph, then suddenly think you're not going to make the turn, what will you do? (genuine question)

you're not a TT racer, take it to the track & let the pros help you before you get yourself, or worse someone else killed

one more thing how often to you practice hard braking from 90mph?
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:53 AM   #10
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no offense but being able to wheelie a 50cc scooter doesn't mean you can handle a 600cc sportbike at high speeds. I get that you like the thrill of cornering fast but thats what tracks are for, riding on the street you always have to give yourself a way out of situations, situations that WILL happen even on an abandoned road. say you take a corner at 90mph, then suddenly think you're not going to make the turn, what will you do? (genuine question)

you're not a TT racer, take it to the track & let the pros help you before you get yourself, or worse someone else killed

one more thing how often to you practice hard braking from 90mph?
- I said i am discovering wheelieing scooters is irrelevant.

- I have no access to a track..closest is a long drive away that allows only few days for bikes year round at ~$200 for 40min sessions-- no instructors (it's an official F1 racetrack).

- you can't possibly think you won't make a corner when your just banking a half of what the bike can.

- did it a few times just brought the bike up and braked in a straightline while downshifting.. felt like it was helping me with learning absolutely nothing..so i am asking for tips..maybe there are some instructors here.
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:08 AM   #11
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ok ok lets see if i can help out with hints and tips:

rule number 1: ride within the speed limit. no need to corner at 90. rather spend your time practicing emergency stops, or sverve and stop, at low speed in a parking lot. say 30 -40 mph max.

rule number 2: keep the rmp below 7K while practicing. helps sticking to rule 1. practice up and down shifting at low rpm, while doing lane change etc. in other word get comfy with the bike.

rule 3: set a target time wiase, i.e commit to 1 hour of practice, then take it out on the street, sticking to rules 1 and 2 above. forget about corner speed, rather do corner teqchnique. focus on that.

enjoy
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:16 AM   #12
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Quote:
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- you can't possibly think you won't make a corner when your just banking a half of what the bike can.
really? never heard of target fixation?

why don't you practice the slow speed stuff & riding in traffic since you say you're not confident with that. speed will increase as your experience & skill level does, going balls to the wall in the 1st 5 days isn't necessary. that road will be there when you want to blow off steam safely
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:23 AM   #13
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sameh90 were not flaming you. we want you to practise and learn and want you to be responsible about it. this is all constructive criticism don't read emotion into it or the thread will go to chaos pretty quickly.

are you familair with target fixation, adequate gear, how to use the brakes and when, in other words how experienced would you rate yourself on a scale from 1 to 10 (10 being the ultimate rider)
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:09 AM   #14
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Not even gonna say it.

whoa, post 8,000.
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:39 AM   #15
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don't worry i don't get emotional..i am just looking for some written advice..everywhere i go people tell me to go practice but noone tells me what to practice or they ask for a reservation on my kidneys...

anyway thanks swan-rr5 and clx for the advice, i'll try to stick to that for now
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:44 AM   #16
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clx and swan-rr5 are only offering considerate and practical advise. I dont have acces to a track, the country doesnt have one. I practice on the streets but do so at really slow speeds around asymmetrical roundabouts at times with minimal traffic (even this has its dangers). swan-rr5's question is very important, you havent really answered it yet. We sometimes react differently when we feel we are going to crash or are 'out of control'. My first crash happened in the blink of an eye. Overzealous entry into a decreasing radius corner (which I have never passed through in a bike before) realized I was not going to make it and the only thing I remember 'feeling' is 'jump off the bike'????? Now after studying and reflecting a lot I asked myself " what the fudge was I thinking" but I cant blame myself for how I reacted when things got out of control. I can blame myself for attempting to negotiate a turn I have never seen from a bike before at a higher speed that I can manage. I can blame myself for not doing more studying into emergency reactions, and how to handle them.

Target fixation can put you on your ass faster than you can say 'target'. If you didnt know that, then I recommend watching Twist of the Wrist 2 as does the entire forum. You will learn a lot especially about how to deal with 'suprises at 80mph corners'.

There are mental notes I keep in my mind which I have gathered from many sources and like wording them as follows, they hopefully will elaborate on what you need to think when on your bike:

- This is your bike, stay the hell on it and consider it your better half.
- The bike can and will make the turn, just do what you LEARNED (which will come with practice)
- The rear brake can be used on the street, practicing in a straight line to develop a feel for it and then in moderate speed turns (in a controlled environment) can make the difference between making the turn and crashing. Smoothness is key.
- All your weight off the handlebars at all times.......all times.....even when tucked in on the highway.

Think about all this, watch TWOT2 and we are all here to help each other.

Good Luck
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:51 AM   #17
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sameh take it easy, one step at a time, even if u feel u r getting confident on the bike going at 80mph, u will lose all that confidence once God forbid u r faced with some obstacle or an accounted-for encounter. A fist size pebble, a cat crossing the street, or some irrigation leak will send you to the afterlife at 800 mph. And thats why you need to be on the track for those speeds. Iv been riding for 2 years and till now I am learning, facing close calls, and thinking of how crazy and irresponsible I was when I first started riding going at speeds that I thought I was confident at.
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Old 11-05-2012, 05:55 AM   #18
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Quote:
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clx and swan-rr5 are only offering considerate and practical advise. I dont have acces to a track, the country doesnt have one. I practice on the streets but do so at really slow speeds around asymmetrical roundabouts at times with minimal traffic (even this has its dangers). swan-rr5's question is very important, you havent really answered it yet. We sometimes react differently when we feel we are going to crash or are 'out of control'. My first crash happened in the blink of an eye. Overzealous entry into a decreasing radius corner (which I have never passed through in a bike before) realized I was not going to make it and the only thing I remember 'feeling' is 'jump off the bike'????? Now after studying and reflecting a lot I asked myself " what the fudge was I thinking" but I cant blame myself for how I reacted when things got out of control. I can blame myself for attempting to negotiate a turn I have never seen from a bike before at a higher speed that I can manage. I can blame myself for not doing more studying into emergency reactions, and how to handle them.

Target fixation can put you on your ass faster than you can say 'target'. If you didnt know that, then I recommend watching Twist of the Wrist 2 as does the entire forum. You will learn a lot especially about how to deal with 'suprises at 80mph corners'.

There are mental notes I keep in my mind which I have gathered from many sources and like wording them as follows, they hopefully will elaborate on what you need to think when on your bike:

- This is your bike, stay the hell on it and consider it your better half.
- The bike can and will make the turn, just do what you LEARNED (which will come with practice)
- The rear brake can be used on the street, practicing in a straight line to develop a feel for it and then in moderate speed turns (in a controlled environment) can make the difference between making the turn and crashing. Smoothness is key.
- All your weight off the handlebars at all times.......all times.....even when tucked in on the highway.

Think about all this, watch TWOT2 and we are all here to help each other.

Good Luck

looooool at how we are always active at the same time of the day (probably everyone else on the forum is still asleep)
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:17 AM   #19
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looooool at how we are always active at the same time of the day (probably everyone else on the forum is still asleep)
That is so true! I make all my posts for the day and then come in the next day at work to see all the reactions and what not after people wake up. I only know of us both in similar timezones, so if any replies pop up I'm usually expecting you as everyone else as you said is probably asleep.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:36 AM   #20
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don't worry i don't get emotional..i am just looking for some written advice..everywhere i go people tell me to go practice but noone tells me what to practice or they ask for a reservation on my kidneys...

anyway thanks swan-rr5 and clx for the advice, i'll try to stick to that for now

What I did was practice moves for my motorcycle safety test after I got comfortable riding my motorcycle through my different subdivisions near my house (I had an 11 mile long route) for a couple of hours a day. I practiced braking with the front brake while making right turns because I found my natural habit was to squeeze to front brake if I felt like I was going to fall over. I found a motorcycle safety map/drawing what I had to do for each part of the test. After that I went out and road on a Sunday morning when there was no traffic that was the first time I got up to 70 mph on the interstate. Got a feel for that and the next day I was riding to school in heavy traffic.

After 5,000 or 3 months of riding, I rode from South Carolina to Tennessee on my bike. Went to the Dragon with some people 600rr.net and had the best learning experience Ive experienced so far. We rode hard, but I knew I had to keep the rubber side down. They told me to ride at my own pace and I did that. Whenever I lost sight of them on the skyway, I slowed the fu*k down. When I was on the dragon I followed their lines the best I could.

Practicing figure 8's will help to develop the skills needed to make tight turns at slow speeds, and make u-turns with looking like an idiot who just got a bike.

Lastly find people (that are responsible) to ride with and ride behind them or beside them in separate lanes. Communicate your intentions when riding (don't cut people off and etc)


Good luck and I hope this helps.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:41 AM   #21
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Target fixation can put you on your ass faster than you can say 'target'. If you didnt know that, then I recommend watching Twist of the Wrist 2 as does the entire forum. You will learn a lot especially about how to deal with 'suprises at 80mph corners'.
I second this so much. This kept my friend from running over me when I went down a month ago. So happy I show this to him.
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Old 11-05-2012, 06:46 AM   #22
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some irrigation leak will send you to the afterlife at 800 mph.
Haha.. I can't imagine riding at 800 mph on a street 600rr.The irrigation leak would be me sh*ting myself.
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Old 11-05-2012, 07:11 AM   #23
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...So 5 days into riding...

Perhaps the next Jorge?



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Old 11-05-2012, 07:33 AM   #24
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like I've said already, I get why you want to take corners fast, I love corners. I couldn't give a flying f**k how fast my bike can go in a straight line, but carrying a good amount of speed & lean angle into a corner, nothing can beat that feeling.

but I don't think this should be where you start when you've only been riding 5 days, these bikes are not toys, they will kill you if you don't respect both them & the street you're riding on. get out there & put some miles on the bike in the real world, you will soon realise that you don't need to be able to swerve an obstacle at 90mph, because you shouldn't be doing that speed. if the road is clear & offers good visibility then fine, give it more juice through the turn, but if you go in blind theres the very real danger of meeting something cutting that corner, or you go wide & cross the line.

I've been road riding for 10+ years now & I've seen/done some stupid stuff, like putting the bike in a ditch because I couldn't make the turn & focused on the tree I was heading towards instead of trying to turn the bike (target fixation). I still have occasions where survival reactions kick in & I go wide in turns, luckily the other side of the road has been empty on these occasions.

I don't mean that to sound hard on you, but theres guys on here who have buried friends, I myself have seen friends go down & walked away luckily without too much damage. learn from the mistakes of others, bikers & car drivers alike & always have a way out of a situation by riding within your limits. you're never too "good" to learn from others, I certainly learn something new often when talking to guys or reading posts on here.

so yeah learn to ride safely, your speed will increase with time & experience
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Old 11-05-2012, 10:00 AM   #25
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whoa, post 8,000.
Save 9,000th post for the suprises at 90mph thread.
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Old 11-05-2012, 10:11 AM   #26
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So 5 days into riding and i am picking up confidence quite quick
Well, there's your first mistake. 5 days of riding a sport bike and you already feel confident. There is just so much to learn that feeling a bit more comfortable on your bike is one thing, but Don't overestimate your riding abilities. It will take years and years before you should feel confident with your riding ability, especially on a race replica super sport bike. The likely hood is that you probably suck at riding (right now) just like everyone of us did the first 5 years or so. It's nothing to take personally, You just need to except that and hold off trying to push the bike faster when you won't be able to control it. We all go through that stage when we think we're fast and quickly reminded that we aren't and have much to learn. Some people have to get killed or seriously injured to find that out. The reality is, you don't even need to break the speed limit on the street to be a good sport rider. Once you find some good turns work on body position, braking, and smooth throttle control. Try to learn the lines you have to take on your favorite roads. That is where you will become a better rider.
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:46 PM
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:52 PM   #27
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These guys corner much faster:



Difference? One knew his limit, the other didn't
love this shot, the guys a demon on a bike!

but yeah knowing your own limits is important, good call brett
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Old 11-05-2012, 04:09 PM   #28
sameh90
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thanks all for the advice
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Old 11-05-2012, 07:42 PM   #29
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after reading this post by you sameh90
http://www.600rr.net/vb/showthread.php?t=293132
i think you need to be careful and forget the 90mph cornering and trying to be a TT rider for the time been
take care
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Old 11-05-2012, 11:38 PM   #30
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okay so somehow by describing the bend as one that a TT racer would take at 160 mph and i was doing it at 80-90..i become the 5 days idiot who thinks he can takle 90 mph bends like a TT racer..

anywhore i'll be posting a vid later to show its more or less a straight..who knows maybe you'll never hear from me again and you guyz will have a good exhortation to teach other new-comers a lesson about attempting 'deadly' maneuvers

Last edited by sameh90; 11-05-2012 at 11:40 PM.
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