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surprises at 80mph corners

10K views 64 replies 27 participants last post by  James_ 
#1 ·
So 5 days into riding and i am picking up confidence quite quick..however i am beginning to worry about overdoing it and crashing myself to death. So where and how can you practice dealing with that surprise sand pile on moderate-high speed bends?

I know trackdays aren't really a good choice because acting wierdly halfway through track corners is a no-no with other experienced riders on your tail.

There is a well-lit 3 mile backroad leading to a dead-end nearby that i've use to practice 80-90 mph cornering (i think 130 is possible but ...one step at a time :) ). Road is generally bent to one side with sub-bends so generally you can always see oncoming traffic ~1 mile down the road.

So what kind of maneuvers can i do to prepare myself for cornering surprises (bringing up bike and hard brakes in such situtations didn't work good for me..ended up off-road twice)
 
#2 ·
I'd have to say you would kill yourself pretty fast cornering at 90mph, 5 days into riding. You ended up off road because there will never be enough room for you to brake at 90mph in a corner on public roads. Even if you see any surprise into the corner, you won't be able to react at that speed.
 
#3 ·
Ehh don't practice too much on the streets. The streets will surprise you, the best riders know that. You can't predict the conditions of the road. Even an unexpected bump can throw your suspension off causing a crash. It takes a lot of skill to properly control a bike. It can't be learned in a couple of days or a couple of years or a lifetime. You never really stop learning.

And track days are made for newbs! Instructors, classes, the works :). Going to the track is the best thing you can do man.


Sent from my iPhone using Motorcycle.com Free App
 
#4 ·
rather practice slowing down for turns. stick to the speed limit, then slow down. practicing stability and technique at safe speeds is more important than practicing street racing. youve been offraod twice which tells you you are riding outside your limits and its just a matter of time before you kill yourself or others.

slow down or go to a track please
 
#6 · (Edited)
i understand your concern but this stretch of road is literally abandoned..maybe a car or 2 every hour or less (which in any case will be visible miles away).... the road is level, well paved (0 pot-holes, 0 gravel -- no nothing..not to mention i cruise around it slowly first evertime scanning for hazards) and wide (can fit 4 f150's side by side). I only ended offroad (also just few feet off the pavement, with the bike upright --no falls) when i decided to bring it up and brake harshly for no reason but to test how i will cope with emergencies.. I am asking what is a good practice to prepare for sudden swerves or harsh brakes. no tracks nearby, not to mention at track you plan every corner and go with the flow..doesn't really prepare you for sudden swerves.
plus most of these bends are so wide that prolly an isle of man TT racer would take them at 160 mph.. 90 on them is possible without flooring down the chicken stripes ..feels very far from the limit. I am still hesistant around traffic I take a side and constantly avoid being around cars..it's not street racing I am mentioning here.. think of it as a private track.

P.S. I am not completely new to 2 wheelers, i owned a 50cc and 90cc scooters (both impounded) as a teenager both of which i could wheelie..but i don't think that really counts as I am discovering.
 
#9 ·
no offense but being able to wheelie a 50cc scooter doesn't mean you can handle a 600cc sportbike at high speeds. I get that you like the thrill of cornering fast but thats what tracks are for, riding on the street you always have to give yourself a way out of situations, situations that WILL happen even on an abandoned road. say you take a corner at 90mph, then suddenly think you're not going to make the turn, what will you do? (genuine question)

you're not a TT racer, take it to the track & let the pros help you before you get yourself, or worse someone else killed

one more thing how often to you practice hard braking from 90mph?
 
#10 ·
no offense but being able to wheelie a 50cc scooter doesn't mean you can handle a 600cc sportbike at high speeds. I get that you like the thrill of cornering fast but thats what tracks are for, riding on the street you always have to give yourself a way out of situations, situations that WILL happen even on an abandoned road. say you take a corner at 90mph, then suddenly think you're not going to make the turn, what will you do? (genuine question)

you're not a TT racer, take it to the track & let the pros help you before you get yourself, or worse someone else killed

one more thing how often to you practice hard braking from 90mph?
- I said i am discovering wheelieing scooters is irrelevant.

- I have no access to a track..closest is a long drive away that allows only few days for bikes year round at ~$200 for 40min sessions-- no instructors (it's an official F1 racetrack).

- you can't possibly think you won't make a corner when your just banking a half of what the bike can.

- did it a few times just brought the bike up and braked in a straightline while downshifting.. felt like it was helping me with learning absolutely nothing..so i am asking for tips..maybe there are some instructors here.
 
#11 ·
ok ok lets see if i can help out with hints and tips:

rule number 1: ride within the speed limit. no need to corner at 90. rather spend your time practicing emergency stops, or sverve and stop, at low speed in a parking lot. say 30 -40 mph max.

rule number 2: keep the rmp below 7K while practicing. helps sticking to rule 1. practice up and down shifting at low rpm, while doing lane change etc. in other word get comfy with the bike.

rule 3: set a target time wiase, i.e commit to 1 hour of practice, then take it out on the street, sticking to rules 1 and 2 above. forget about corner speed, rather do corner teqchnique. focus on that.

enjoy
 
#13 ·
sameh90 were not flaming you. we want you to practise and learn and want you to be responsible about it. this is all constructive criticism don't read emotion into it or the thread will go to chaos pretty quickly.

are you familair with target fixation, adequate gear, how to use the brakes and when, in other words how experienced would you rate yourself on a scale from 1 to 10 (10 being the ultimate rider)
 
#15 ·
don't worry i don't get emotional..i am just looking for some written advice..everywhere i go people tell me to go practice but noone tells me what to practice or they ask for a reservation on my kidneys...

anyway thanks swan-rr5 and clx for the advice, i'll try to stick to that for now
 
#20 ·
What I did was practice moves for my motorcycle safety test after I got comfortable riding my motorcycle through my different subdivisions near my house (I had an 11 mile long route) for a couple of hours a day. I practiced braking with the front brake while making right turns because I found my natural habit was to squeeze to front brake if I felt like I was going to fall over. I found a motorcycle safety map/drawing what I had to do for each part of the test. After that I went out and road on a Sunday morning when there was no traffic that was the first time I got up to 70 mph on the interstate. Got a feel for that and the next day I was riding to school in heavy traffic.

After 5,000 or 3 months of riding, I rode from South Carolina to Tennessee on my bike. Went to the Dragon with some people 600rr.net and had the best learning experience I’ve experienced so far. We rode hard, but I knew I had to keep the rubber side down. They told me to ride at my own pace and I did that. Whenever I lost sight of them on the skyway, I slowed the fu*k down. When I was on the dragon I followed their lines the best I could.

Practicing figure 8's will help to develop the skills needed to make tight turns at slow speeds, and make u-turns with looking like an idiot who just got a bike.

Lastly find people (that are responsible) to ride with and ride behind them or beside them in separate lanes. Communicate your intentions when riding (don't cut people off and etc)


Good luck and I hope this helps.
 
#16 · (Edited)
clx and swan-rr5 are only offering considerate and practical advise. I dont have acces to a track, the country doesnt have one. I practice on the streets but do so at really slow speeds around asymmetrical roundabouts at times with minimal traffic (even this has its dangers). swan-rr5's question is very important, you havent really answered it yet. We sometimes react differently when we feel we are going to crash or are 'out of control'. My first crash happened in the blink of an eye. Overzealous entry into a decreasing radius corner (which I have never passed through in a bike before) realized I was not going to make it and the only thing I remember 'feeling' is 'jump off the bike'????? Now after studying and reflecting a lot I asked myself " what the fudge was I thinking" but I cant blame myself for how I reacted when things got out of control. I can blame myself for attempting to negotiate a turn I have never seen from a bike before at a higher speed that I can manage. I can blame myself for not doing more studying into emergency reactions, and how to handle them.

Target fixation can put you on your ass faster than you can say 'target'. If you didnt know that, then I recommend watching Twist of the Wrist 2 as does the entire forum. You will learn a lot especially about how to deal with 'suprises at 80mph corners'.

There are mental notes I keep in my mind which I have gathered from many sources and like wording them as follows, they hopefully will elaborate on what you need to think when on your bike:

- This is your bike, stay the hell on it and consider it your better half.
- The bike can and will make the turn, just do what you LEARNED (which will come with practice)
- The rear brake can be used on the street, practicing in a straight line to develop a feel for it and then in moderate speed turns (in a controlled environment) can make the difference between making the turn and crashing. Smoothness is key.
- All your weight off the handlebars at all times.......all times.....even when tucked in on the highway.

Think about all this, watch TWOT2 and we are all here to help each other.

Good Luck
 
#18 ·
clx and swan-rr5 are only offering considerate and practical advise. I dont have acces to a track, the country doesnt have one. I practice on the streets but do so at really slow speeds around asymmetrical roundabouts at times with minimal traffic (even this has its dangers). swan-rr5's question is very important, you havent really answered it yet. We sometimes react differently when we feel we are going to crash or are 'out of control'. My first crash happened in the blink of an eye. Overzealous entry into a decreasing radius corner (which I have never passed through in a bike before) realized I was not going to make it and the only thing I remember 'feeling' is 'jump off the bike'????? Now after studying and reflecting a lot I asked myself " what the fudge was I thinking" but I cant blame myself for how I reacted when things got out of control. I can blame myself for attempting to negotiate a turn I have never seen from a bike before at a higher speed that I can manage. I can blame myself for not doing more studying into emergency reactions, and how to handle them.

Target fixation can put you on your ass faster than you can say 'target'. If you didnt know that, then I recommend watching Twist of the Wrist 2 as does the entire forum. You will learn a lot especially about how to deal with 'suprises at 80mph corners'.

There are mental notes I keep in my mind which I have gathered from many sources and like wording them as follows, they hopefully will elaborate on what you need to think when on your bike:

- This is your bike, stay the hell on it and consider it your better half.
- The bike can and will make the turn, just do what you LEARNED (which will come with practice)
- The rear brake can be used on the street, practicing in a straight line to develop a feel for it and then in moderate speed turns (in a controlled environment) can make the difference between making the turn and crashing. Smoothness is key.
- All your weight off the handlebars at all times.......all times.....even when tucked in on the highway.

Think about all this, watch TWOT2 and we are all here to help each other.

Good Luck

looooool at how we are always active at the same time of the day (probably everyone else on the forum is still asleep)
 
#17 ·
sameh take it easy, one step at a time, even if u feel u r getting confident on the bike going at 80mph, u will lose all that confidence once God forbid u r faced with some obstacle or an accounted-for encounter. A fist size pebble, a cat crossing the street, or some irrigation leak will send you to the afterlife at 800 mph. And thats why you need to be on the track for those speeds. Iv been riding for 2 years and till now I am learning, facing close calls, and thinking of how crazy and irresponsible I was when I first started riding going at speeds that I thought I was confident at.
 
#22 · (Edited)
some irrigation leak will send you to the afterlife at 800 mph.
Haha.. I can't imagine riding at 800 mph on a street 600rr.The irrigation leak would be me sh*ting myself.
 
#24 ·
like I've said already, I get why you want to take corners fast, I love corners. I couldn't give a flying f**k how fast my bike can go in a straight line, but carrying a good amount of speed & lean angle into a corner, nothing can beat that feeling.

but I don't think this should be where you start when you've only been riding 5 days, these bikes are not toys, they will kill you if you don't respect both them & the street you're riding on. get out there & put some miles on the bike in the real world, you will soon realise that you don't need to be able to swerve an obstacle at 90mph, because you shouldn't be doing that speed. if the road is clear & offers good visibility then fine, give it more juice through the turn, but if you go in blind theres the very real danger of meeting something cutting that corner, or you go wide & cross the line.

I've been road riding for 10+ years now & I've seen/done some stupid stuff, like putting the bike in a ditch because I couldn't make the turn & focused on the tree I was heading towards instead of trying to turn the bike (target fixation). I still have occasions where survival reactions kick in & I go wide in turns, luckily the other side of the road has been empty on these occasions.

I don't mean that to sound hard on you, but theres guys on here who have buried friends, I myself have seen friends go down & walked away luckily without too much damage. learn from the mistakes of others, bikers & car drivers alike & always have a way out of a situation by riding within your limits. you're never too "good" to learn from others, I certainly learn something new often when talking to guys or reading posts on here.

so yeah learn to ride safely, your speed will increase with time & experience
 
#26 ·
So 5 days into riding and i am picking up confidence quite quick
Well, there's your first mistake. 5 days of riding a sport bike and you already feel confident. There is just so much to learn that feeling a bit more comfortable on your bike is one thing, but Don't overestimate your riding abilities. It will take years and years before you should feel confident with your riding ability, especially on a race replica super sport bike. The likely hood is that you probably suck at riding (right now) just like everyone of us did the first 5 years or so. It's nothing to take personally, You just need to except that and hold off trying to push the bike faster when you won't be able to control it. We all go through that stage when we think we're fast and quickly reminded that we aren't and have much to learn. Some people have to get killed or seriously injured to find that out. The reality is, you don't even need to break the speed limit on the street to be a good sport rider. Once you find some good turns work on body position, braking, and smooth throttle control. Try to learn the lines you have to take on your favorite roads. That is where you will become a better rider.
 
#29 ·
#30 · (Edited)
okay so somehow by describing the bend as one that a TT racer would take at 160 mph and i was doing it at 80-90..i become the 5 days idiot who thinks he can takle 90 mph bends like a TT racer..

anywhore i'll be posting a vid later to show its more or less a straight..who knows maybe you'll never hear from me again and you guyz will have a good exhortation to teach other new-comers a lesson about attempting 'deadly' maneuvers
 
#32 ·
we're all trying to give an inexperienced rider some advice to keep you from getting hurt, can't you see that?

this is a public forum, if you don't want advice then don't post for advice, ride your bike however you want, we're not your guardians & the consequences of yor actions won't affect me.

good luck with it anyway
 
#31 · (Edited)
sameh....

posts of mine off another forum:
"I do not 'resist the urge,' I just plan it which is not really any better. Whether you are weaving in and out of traffic or on a lonely 2 lane road, the consequences are the same and very real, and your time WILL come.

I always scout the road 1st for turnoffs, debris, tar snakes, driving culture, etc. When you do that it really reduces the opportunities to 'push the limits'.

If i am going to push it, I leave my house knowing exactly where and how I intend to do it, top speed run, or twisties.

Guess you haven't come around a corner(even a slight bend in the road) in a 45 to a semi trailer going up hill in 1st gear? you have 3 options, 1 brake while turning, 2 blindly pass, 3 go off a cliff or into the side. And those 3 assume you do not dump it"
.......................................
"Ok setting is my favorite section of twisties out in the boonies...

-I do a spirited run to check for road debris before i push it (good)
-take a break at the end (good)
-take off with my low beams on (ok)
-realized I cant see **** and forgot to put my high beams on (bad)
-Target fixate on where my high beams flashed, and ride into the other lane(really bad)
-lean harder to bring myself back into my lane, while not looking where i want to be( bad)
-accelerate slightly, scrape peg, everythings ok..."
.............................................................
Can you feel the difference in 3lbs of air pressure? or as your tires warm up?
Have you broken the rear end loose? straight? in a turn? in lean?
If in a corner a milkshake hit your helmet could you maintain your lean through the turn blind?
Have you locked your front end up or washed out before?
Popped a wheelie?
Gone airborne? straight? in a lean?
Can you do the turn with 2 fingers and your thumb on the throttle, one hand on your waist? no feet on the pegs? one foot? not touching the seat? in neutral? leaning the wrong way?
How good is your balance on the bike? How well do you know the balance of the bike?
What if you roadkill a frog?
Can you truly mentally COMMIT to a corner?
If a rock/bug gets in your eye, can you still maintain? how long until the shock of pain wares off, probably a lot longer than it takes to throw the bike.
Do tar stripes or paint lines give you a rush? how much can you slip? How hard have your tires caught the pavement?

Get some sliders and learn this AND MORE at slower speeds please. some i would not recommend on the street.

9k in third ~80 +/- 10, I was lucky to SLIDE on my back 50 ft and stop 20 ft from the railing, got squirmy shifted weight, front washed out, and down i went.


Wish i could do this
http://www.dump.com/unrealcontrol/

.... who knows maybe this thread keeps you from becoming a cripple or wasting the search and rescue teams time sending out a chopper for you.

when was the last time you made your peace? be a little more careful with the adrenaline.
 
#36 ·
So what kind of maneuvers can i do to prepare myself for cornering surprises (bringing up bike and hard brakes in such situtations didn't work good for me..ended up off-road twice)

Bringing the bike up and braking is the only way... If you run of the road, you're going too fast. It's that simple. You either risk your life and whoever might be coming the other way, or you keep your bike under control and able to avoid hazards. There's no in between on the road.
 
#37 · (Edited)
so quick video ... camera at apex ... tried to capture last minutes of daylight..all was fine until casper decided to tip over my phone ..don't watch if you value time..

anyway someone knows what the hell is that sound at 2:43 as I begin engaging clutch into first?

EDIT: actually as soon as i shift down to first even before clutch matching

 
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