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sargeek1975 said:
Discuss....................lol
Its kinda true. I mean if you're going to go faster and take risks, your probability of wrecking is higher. If you're prepared to ride fast, you better be prepared to take a wreck at that speed. Because evenetually it'll happen.
 

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I think the truth to that comment is that the faster you go, the less amount of room for error you have.
 

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It is true...when i first started on the track, i took it easy and didnt crash but when I started to care about lap times, I rode the bike harder and practice like it was a race...needless to say, you're taking a higher risk of crashing and I did crash several times and all have been lowsides
 

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sargeek1975 said:
So you're saying that the only way to learn to ride faster is to actually try and ride above your current level?


Say.............110% of your skill level?
No, we're just saying its a higher chance of you wrecking if you're riding harder. Like eazy said, there's less room for error.
 

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sargeek1975 said:
So you're saying that the only way to learn to ride faster is to actually try and ride above your current level?


Say.............110% of your skill level?
Ride within your limits....thats the main rule...you will improve with more seat time on the track
 

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papo600RR said:
Ride within your limits....thats the main rule...you will improve with more seat time on the track
I ride within my limits on the street(like around 75% of my limits) But at the track you have to push yourself a little bit past your limits to get better... and then a little more and a little more.. Problem is dont take a giant bit and choke on it..
 

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sargeek1975 said:
That's at the heart of my question:


Who believes that you have to ride above your level to get faster? Obviously you do Alpine; who else?
But to a point.... you have to be smooth before you can be fast.. I mean you want work on that first and then push yourself...
 

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sargeek1975 said:
So you're saying that the only way to learn to ride faster is to actually try and ride above your current level?


Say.............110% of your skill level?
Yes you must ride above your current level but I believe it is your comfort level not skill level. My progression in getting faster has always been getting past mental blocks like damaging my bike, getting hurt and just plain faith in my own riding skills.

sargeek1975 said:
But then why would I wreck?
My first crash after three years of trackdays and racing was caused by oil on the track by the leader of the race.
 

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sargeek1975 said:
So I'll re-word it then and ask another question:




Can I become faster out on the track if I only ever ride at say 85% of my skill level? And if so; do I stand a high chance of wrecking?
Good question. See this has been my theory on riding since I started. I believe you can improve. Just because you're not going all out doesn't mean you're not learning critical things on the track. If anything you're going to become faster just because you're being smoother.

As for your chance of wrecking, I believe its a lot lower.
 

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sargeek1975 said:
That's at the heart of my question:


Who believes that you have to ride above your level to get faster? Obviously you do Alpine; who else?
I do too but it's a little more complicated than that. I think you can ride within your limits and get faster because of more track time, better knowledge of your bike and what the suspension and tires are doing etc.

I also think that to improve, sometimes you have to go over what your "perceived" limits are. A lot of this is mental anyway so if you can overcome a mental barrier(whatever that may be) that will in turn, make you more confident, smoother at speed, less apt to panic etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
eazy e said:
Good question. See this has been my theory on riding since I started. I believe you can improve. Just because you're not going all out doesn't mean you're not learning critical things on the track. If anything you're going to become faster just because you're being smoother.

As for your chance of wrecking, I believe its a lot lower.
As if anyone hasn't guessed yet; this is my belief as well.



It kinda irk's me when I hear people stating that you have to ride above your level to get faster, like the comment RLS just made.

I think riding above your level does nothing but make the track an unsafe place for everyone while you're out there.


I am proof positive that you can become faster while riding within your limits; even during races.
 

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sargeek1975 said:
It kinda irk's me when I hear people stating that you have to ride above your level to get faster, like the comment RLS just made.

I think riding above your level does nothing but make the track an unsafe place for everyone while you're out there.


I am proof positive that you can become faster while riding within your limits; even during races.
So you ALWAYs ride well with in your limits on the track?
 

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I think that we're all missing a certain point in this conversation.

When you're riding faster and faster on the track, not only are you pushing the limits of your own skill levels, you may be pushing the limits of your current suspension, tires, physics, et cetera. There are so many factors going into a crash.

Let me ask a question: MotoGP riders are the number one professionals in our industry. They still crash. They are constantly pushing the limits of everything. Does that mean they're riding above their skill level? Probably not. Why do you think John Hopkins bike is FULLY electronic? This thing is insane. It even has sensors in the rearsets and the handlebars to give data on how much pressure he is putting on them fully leaned and in straightaways. All this data helps them figure out how to make the bike faster, but it also helps them figure out the factors of a crash.

I think my main point here is that mistakes inevitably happen, regardless of your skill level and regardless of your ability to "push the limits."
 

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Discussion Starter #20
chkaotic said:
If you want to know how to walk better, you have to know what it feels like to fall
That's gotta be the dumbest thing I've ever heard.


I guess when my daughter starts to walk for the very first time I'll just run up to her and knock her over. When she starts crying and my wife asks me why in the world I would ever do that, I'll just say that I want her to be the best walker ever!!!!



AlpineJim said:
So you ALWAYs ride well with in your limits on the track?
I try to...............

This last track day on the new RR I was in the Blue group with TPM. During my second session I came in early because I thought I was going wayyyy too damn fast out there for a track day.

No Coaches were keeping up with me and two of my friends on my race team (who I could NEVER catch during a race or track day last year while I was on my F4) couldn't keep up with me either.

I felt that it was time to pit in because I was enjoying that speed and pushing the bike a little bit too much to be healthy and safe out there.
 
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