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Discussion Starter #1
Let me start by saying that my dislike and distrust of the democratic party does NOT mean that I'm a conservative republican. I'm for same sex marriage, and believe in a woman's right to choose. I do NOT believe in god and feel that democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Obviously it goes MUCH deeper, but this is a start.

Liberty is freedom.

http://www.lp.org/platform
 

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you are for the individual instead of for the group. you don't think democracy works

thats ok.

but is there anything better than democracy?
 

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you are for the individual instead of for the group. you don't think democracy works

thats ok.

but is there anything better than democracy?
Everyone abuses their power. I have to guess you are referrring America has democracy. While talking about how America is so "democratic" what did you vote on? You voted for representative who gets lobbied by people with power/money. These representatives are not held accountable, other than next election if that even matters, for not doing what they promised prior to elections.
Did you get to vote on America's war decisions, military budget, SS/medicare/medicaid, NSA, senators pay check, health care? These are very few of very important things that are going to effect our lives yet we don't get to vote on these things. We get to vote on representative who lie to us to get elected.
Also dumb people (maybe I'm one of them too, you be the judge) get a say in democracy too. Dumb people are subject to lies, influence, fear mongering. Just by watching TV or reading 2 paragraph article they thing I know everything there is to know about an X subject.
In extreme cases with democracy 51% could be making decision for %49.

Lets not look at any country and cherry pick examples to push our view point. It is misleading to say America is the worst or the greatest country. Some ways I think it is better on other ways it worst than many.
 

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You voted for representative who gets lobbied by people with power/money. These representatives are not held accountable, other than next election if that even matters, for not doing what they promised prior to elections.
Did you get to vote on America's war decisions, military budget, SS/medicare/medicaid, NSA, senators pay check, health care? These are very few of very important things that are going to effect our lives yet we don't get to vote on these things. We get to vote on representative who lie to us to get elected.
Also dumb people (maybe I'm one of them too, you be the judge) get a say in democracy too. Dumb people are subject to lies, influence, fear mongering. Just by watching TV or reading 2 paragraph article they thing I know everything there is to know about an X subject.
Pretty much dude pretty much.

I don't think the people were ever given a vote in the most important stuff that makes the country run.
We're supposed to sit here and trust that the officials that we elect (lol-Ever hear of electoral votes) are smart enough to work together and keep this country running like a greased cog.
These days it's blind faith with plenty of bills being passed behind the scenes by lobbyists, special interest groups and the companies they represent.
Plenty of favors and money being spread around to everyone except the people that our politicians are supposed to represent, that's us.
The rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and the super rich get HOLY F**K rich.

Some other countries hold their politicians accountable when they get out of line in the form of civil unrest. They take to the streets in huge masses and cause a big o'l stink. Sometimes they pay the price with their lives.
In this country we sit here and say gosh darn it here we go again just like all the previous candidates this fool is lying to us, giving away our money, raising taxes, and taking away more of our rights.
A few may politely protest with signs and chants but most do nothing but carry on thinking "Well that'll change when we vote him out"...
Oh yea that's great, another FEW YEARS of some idiot or several idiots F**KING S**T up along the way.

Once the new politicians take office the story always seems to be the same. Whoops sorry forks we can't change that now, stay the course, or they deny there's even a problem.
When they don't do well they blame it on the previous position holder saying that it's not their fault. They were just the patsy because the problem started before them.
To top it off we pay these jokers a great deal of money for the rest of their lives if they did well or not. Bush Jr. sure as hell doesn't deserve a frigg'n paycheck. That sh*t needs to change and it needs to change now!

The political system that runs this country may have worked way back when but the unfixed, compounded problems year after year are adding up and it's beginning to fail.
This thing the forefathers called a democracy is slowly mutating into something else.




(Go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong. I probably shouldn't have written this with little sleep lol)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Sounds like your Republican with some Democratic views.
That's a fair assessment. Republicans call me a godless liberal. Dems can't understand why I don't support socialist health care with capitalist doctors, hospitals and pharmaceutical companies. Don't get me started on insurance companies.

Raising the debt ceiling is insane, and BOTH parties are to blame. When (not if) something happens, and we default on that debt we are all screwed. The British pound sterling was once the international currency of choice, that changed ~40 years ago. The only reason we're ok now is because people we buy our stuff from like dollars. That will change, and we as a country need to be prepared.

Obama's "head in the sand" approach is making it far worse, far more quickly than ever before.
 

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A Republic, by definition, has two principle elements. First, it is controlled by Law; therefore, it does not control Law. Second, it recognizes the private independent sovereign nature of each person (man or woman) of competent age and capacity; therefore, a Republic must be representative in its nature.

A Republic recognizes Law is unchangeable, or at least that it can only be changed by a higher source than government. In a Republic the concept of “collective sovereignty” cannot exist, except with recognition that the State or nation, as a body of sovereigns, can speak through one elected voice; though that one voice can never lawfully interfere with the private rights of the individual sovereigns.

“A Constitutional Republic” is a government created and controlled, at least, by the Law of a Constitution. The Constitution of the United States of America was, in Law, a foundation based on the Bible, the Magna Carta and the Declaration of Independence. Those documents recognize man’s sovereignty, the divine nature of man’s creation and man’s divine right to Life, Liberty, the means of acquiring and possessing Property, and the pursuit of happiness.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
A Republic, by definition, has two principle elements. First, it is controlled by Law; therefore, it does not control Law. Second, it recognizes the private independent sovereign nature of each person (man or woman) of competent age and capacity; therefore, a Republic must be representative in its nature.

A Republic recognizes Law is unchangeable, or at least that it can only be changed by a higher source than government. In a Republic the concept of “collective sovereignty” cannot exist, except with recognition that the State or nation, as a body of sovereigns, can speak through one elected voice; though that one voice can never lawfully interfere with the private rights of the individual sovereigns.

“A Constitutional Republic” is a government created and controlled, at least, by the Law of a Constitution. The Constitution of the United States of America was, in Law, a foundation based on the Bible, the Magna Carta and the Declaration of Independence. Those documents recognize man’s sovereignty, the divine nature of man’s creation and man’s divine right to Life, Liberty, the means of acquiring and possessing Property, and the pursuit of happiness.
Best post on dotnet award winner right here.
 

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That's a fair assessment. Republicans call me a godless liberal. Dems can't understand why I don't support socialist health care with capitalist doctors, hospitals and pharmaceutical companies. Don't get me started on insurance companies.

Raising the debt ceiling is insane, and BOTH parties are to blame. When (not if) something happens, and we default on that debt we are all screwed. The British pound sterling was once the international currency of choice, that changed ~40 years ago. The only reason we're ok now is because people we buy our stuff from like dollars. That will change, and we as a country need to be prepared.

Obama's "head in the sand" approach is making it far worse, far more quickly than ever before.
Not raising the debt ceiling is how we default. The debt ceiling limits if we can pay for debt we've already incurred.

If you mean that we don't have stronger fiscal responsibility as a nation to not (re)approach the debt ceiling that makes sense. To not raise the debt ceiling now is insane.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Not raising the debt ceiling is how we default. The debt ceiling limits if we can pay for debt we've already incurred.

If you mean that we don't have stronger fiscal responsibility as a nation to not (re)approach the debt ceiling that makes sense. To not raise the debt ceiling now is insane.
Of course we have to raise it. But we also need to start fixing this situation, and Obama is making it worse at record rates. Thinking it can keep going up like this is moronic.
 

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Not raising the debt ceiling is how we default. The debt ceiling limits if we can pay for debt we've already incurred.

If you mean that we don't have stronger fiscal responsibility as a nation to not (re)approach the debt ceiling that makes sense. To not raise the debt ceiling now is insane.
No one's saying to not raise it but the agreement to raise it is the time to agree to do something about it. If the the debt ceiling is always an automatic pass then is there really any debt ceiling at all? Shouldn't we come to a plan on how we're going to pay for yet another loan before we take on even more debt? Money and government is like alcohol to a drunk. They say yeah, I'll start to quit or cut down tomorrow. Tomorrow never comes. As the AA people say, the first step to recovery is admitting you have a problem. :drunk:
 

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Thanks, but I got that definition from a constitutional law website. Most people have no clue what this country was founded on and how far off course we have drifted.
I was hoping like hell you copied and pasted that. Could not be more true though.
 
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