Fed is paying banks to NOT make loans to struggling Americans. - 600RR.net
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post #1 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-30-2009, 02:32 PM Thread Starter
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Fed is paying banks to NOT make loans to struggling Americans.

This is fvcked up...


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post #2 of 31 (permalink) Old 07-30-2009, 06:34 PM
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Ahhh, what a surprise... corporations acting in their best interest and not that of the American people.

Dennis Kucinich is awesome... much respect for that guy.

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post #3 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-02-2009, 04:23 AM
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Yet another way to piss on the American Public. Beg for money, get the money, say you are gonna lend it, but let it sit in your account instead.


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post #4 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-05-2009, 11:19 AM
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Ron Paul explicitly said his vice-president would've been Dennis Kucinich...and vice versa.

man, we could've been looking at some real change had we picked the right men for the job.

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post #5 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-05-2009, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by NesNeedsBoost View Post
Ron Paul explicitly said his vice-president would've been Dennis Kucinich...and vice versa.

man, we could've been looking at some real change had we picked the right men for the job.
Ron never had enough money without the support of all the corrupt lobbyists, no money = no air time on national television, no air time = no presidency... you guys didnt think this whole presidential election thingy actually had anything to do with the guy running for president did you??
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post #6 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-06-2009, 07:19 PM
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i didnt have access to the video, but according to your title, why so wrong about that?

I mean if you know the person is borrowing money from you are struggling and they may not pay you back, why would you want to loan them money in the first place. the reason we got in to the housing crises is because we loan to people we know cant afford that loan, and you are complaining because the government actually learned from experience?

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post #7 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-06-2009, 11:18 PM
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The only trouble that I see with this "learning your lesson" is that they tell people one thing ans then do another. I know that they are all crooks and our country is going to hell because we as Americans are letting it. I do have to say that the representative is awesome.

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post #8 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-08-2009, 02:40 AM
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Originally Posted by wu_dot_com View Post
i didnt have access to the video, but according to your title, why so wrong about that?

I mean if you know the person is borrowing money from you are struggling and they may not pay you back, why would you want to loan them money in the first place. the reason we got in to the housing crises is because we loan to people we know cant afford that loan, and you are complaining because the government actually learned from experience?
This is about the most short sighted ******* response I have ever seen in my life.

Let me fill you in on some details.

So far, the Feds have given the banks (much of them foreign banks) $24 Trillion. Who is going to pay the bill for that? You and your kids, grandkids, their kids, their grandkids etc etc etc.

This money was given to the banks without your consent.

98% of Americans were against any bail outs for the banks, but as usual they didn't listen.

Congressmen were threatened with martial law if they didn't pass the bail out bill.

8 trillion would have paid off everyone in the US's mortgage. That would have been a real stimulus, albeit a hideously socialistic one.

I'd rather the money go to the people, than a bunch of crooked fuckin elitist bankers.

The banks now refuse point blank to tell Congress where the money has gone and how it has been spent. SO much for the much touted "transparency".

The banks, not people borrowing money are to blame for all of this ****.
The repeal of lending regulations and the Glass-Stegall act are what allowed these banks to loan people money that they knew they couldn't pay back, it also allowed the banks to begin trading derivatives; the real problem.
This started in the Clinton administration and has been carried through until today.

Derivatives are the main cause of all financial difficulties that the world is going through. This has been intentional, with the endgame being the reduction in the standard of living of everyone in the Western world.

The "sub prime" BS is just the excuse for what the bankers have done to us and a way for suckers like you to blame people that were sold the bullshit, non-existent American Dream.

While people in the USA are sleeping in tent cities, the scum that run Bank of America and Goldman Sachs are still getting their million dollar + bonuses, and you're paying for it.

It's a bloodless coup de tat carried out by a bunch of foreign bankers. They own us now. The USA is finished and you're busy sticking up for the people that did it to us.

The real reason the Fed are paying these banks not to loan, is that they don't want to monetize the massive amounts of worthless money they have printed up, because that will cause hyper-inflation. That is the reason, not because the motherfuckin government "learned its lesson".

Sheesh, get some sophistication man, and stop watching that god damn idiot box.

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post #9 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-08-2009, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
So far, the Feds have given the banks (much of them foreign banks) $24 Trillion.
I highly doubt the figure is that high. Last time I checked it was definitely larger than 2 trillion, but definitely not 24 trillion.

Granted, 2 trillion un-accounted for dollars is disgusting.

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post #10 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-08-2009, 12:11 PM
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Bank rescue could cost $23.7 trillion, says bailout overseer
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- A package of government bailout packages could cost $23.7 trillion, according to testimony prepared by a special inspector general expected to appear on Capitol Hill this week.

At issue are the landmark $700 billion Troubled Asset Relief Program passed hurriedly last year. The costs include $6.8 trillion in government assistance offered by the Federal Reserve, Neil Barofsky, the inspector general for the Treasury's so-called TARP, is expected to say in his apprance.

Other assistance figuring in his report is the $7.2 trillion in government funding for Fannie Mae /quotes/comstock/13*!fnm/quotes/nls/fnm (FNM 0.66, -0.13, -16.46%) and Freddie Mac /quotes/comstock/13*!fre/quotes/nls/fre (FRE 0.74, -0.10, -11.90%) and other groups, as well as $2.3 trillion in programs provided by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp.

"Before the American people and their representatives in Congress can meaningfully evaluate the effectiveness of TARP, not only must the TARP programs themselves be understood, but also TARP's scope and scale must be placed into proper context with the other government programs designed to support the financial system," Barofsky says in remarks in his written testimony.
More here: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-...at-24-trillion
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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-10-2009, 06:30 AM
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The Federal Reserve does whatever it wants to do... it has no laws. It is better for the Feds to pay the banks for money that will come back to them anyways than having unreliable income do it. They do not care about who's struggling, they know they most likely will not pay their loans back and Americans have learned they have been scammed before because of banks making impossible terms. Problem solved, banks get an interest discount because they no longer receive money from loans, banks do not fail, they continue to pay interests and the ones in charge of the federal reserve banks profit for some more time. Its funny when they say they are not a profit making private organization.

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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-10-2009, 06:43 AM
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Indeed, the Federal Reserve are as federal as Federal Express and have no reserves.
They are a privately owned and run organization of Anglo European bankers.
The organization is unconstitutional and America signed it's death warrant when it signed into law the Federal Reserve Act in 1913.
A good book on the subject of the Fed is The Creature from Jekyll Island by G. Edward Griffin.
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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-10-2009, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
This is about the most short sighted ******* response I have ever seen in my life.
for one, how is it short sighted, for two, after i've read your entire gibberish, i still didn't find how is it short sighted. so stop your internet bullying and learn some internet etiquette.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Let me fill you in on some details.

So far, the Feds have given the banks (much of them foreign banks) $24 Trillion. Who is going to pay the bill for that? You and your kids, grandkids, their kids, their grandkids etc etc etc.
did you even read the so-called proof you provided in your later post, it even said that the $24 Trillion is speculation and overly inflated. matter of fact, I think the pressing question is "CAN you even read". I understand the 1 trillion bailout lacks the transparency we would like to see, but inflating 2-3 trillion to 24 trillion seems to be witch hunt to me.

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This money was given to the banks without your consent.

98% of Americans were against any bail outs for the banks, but as usual they didn't listen.

Congressmen were threatened with martial law if they didn't pass the bail out bill.
I dont know about you, but i am actually supporting the bailout. in case you have alzheimer's disease, let me refresh your memory. last year during October, congress rejected the 700 billion bailout bill for the first time. the stock market drop 700 points in one day. if the congress didn't reconsider passing that bill, all of us will be out of a job by now since there are no knowing of how bad it could of gotten. those people who is opposing those bills are actually really short-sighted since the sign is there all along. you can talk all the conspiracy theory you want, but im basing my judgments on facts.

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8 trillion would have paid off everyone in the US's mortgage. That would have been a real stimulus, albeit a hideously socialistic one.

I'd rather the money go to the people, than a bunch of crooked fuckin elitist bankers.
is this from one of those mass e-mail again, talking about a state to state block party. if you actually do the number, this idea is full of sh!t. the numbers dont add up. plus 8 trillion is about 72% of our current national debt. to be honest, this got to be the stupidest thing I have heard on this subject. its like you are saying lets pile on another 72% more debt so the next few generations will get screw so we don't have to pay mortgage. BTW why would anyone want to spend money on someone's mortgage anyway.

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The banks now refuse point blank to tell Congress where the money has gone and how it has been spent. SO much for the much touted "transparency".
this I agreed with you, the Banks should not refuse to show where the money have gone. but on the other hand, our congress have open their mouth and said damaging things merit all the time.

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The banks, not people borrowing money are to blame for all of this ****.
The repeal of lending regulations and the Glass-Stegall act are what allowed these banks to loan people money that they knew they couldn't pay back, it also allowed the banks to begin trading derivatives; the real problem.
This started in the Clinton administration and has been carried through until today.
what kind of backward logic is this? are you one of those "guns kill people not people kill people" kind of guy? just because you can borrow money in a amount that you are not able to pay back doesnt mean you should go borrow it. its the same thing as just because banks have money doesn't mean you have to go rob it. what ever happen to be responsible for your own actions, or accountability? is this what your parents have taught you? is this what you are teaching to your kids today? no wonder America is going down the sh!t hole.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Derivatives are the main cause of all financial difficulties that the world is going through. This has been intentional, with the endgame being the reduction in the standard of living of everyone in the Western world.
derivatives are design to minimize risk, but individuals failed to act responsibility when they gamble against the unknown odds. I personally still don't see how the ultimate motive behind derivative is to reduce the stander of living as you put it though. once again, need proof.

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The "sub prime" BS is just the excuse for what the bankers have done to us and a way for suckers like you to blame people that were sold the bullshit, non-existent American Dream.
once again, where is the proof? show me how sub prime crises is not real, how counties around the globe is not being effected by it. if you can do that, I can show you how the $24 trillion really does exist. maybe you lived a shelter life, but I am certainly living an American dream. its not exactly fine and dandy as they shown in movies, but it sure is better than what could of happen if I didn't start a new life here.

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While people in the USA are sleeping in tent cities, the scum that run Bank of America and Goldman Sachs are still getting their million dollar + bonuses, and you're paying for it.
I personally dont think they should be paid that much, but the reality is, their salary and bonuses are written in their contract and budgeted for. what happen to the lending crises is not 100% their fault. BTW show me how my bailout go directly to their pockets. because it is certain that their salary and bonuses is minute compare to the hundred billions they need to secure the bad assists.

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It's a bloodless coup de tat carried out by a bunch of foreign bankers. They own us now. The USA is finished and you're busy sticking up for the people that did it to us.
once again, there is another thread for conspiracy theories. so show some solid proof before you move your fingers. also please actually read the entire article before you post next time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
The real reason the Fed are paying these banks not to loan, is that they don't want to monetize the massive amounts of worthless money they have printed up, because that will cause hyper-inflation. That is the reason, not because the motherfuckin government "learned its lesson".
this is the only claim that makes sense in this post, but how does this goes with being short sighted? you matter of fact just agreed with me on the fact that lending money to people is not the best actions right now. also perhaps the government didnt learned the lesson of selective borrowing, but it sure did learn something if what your claiming is true.

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Sheesh, get some sophistication man, and stop watching that god damn idiot box.
I for once have lost the words for a comeback with this comment. I mean what can you say when someone said "get some sophistication". it in it self is wrong on so many levels where i dont even know where to start. I perhaps lacks the sophistication required to answer this question. I am very bad in English, but may i suggest you to say "get sophisticated" instead.
anyway i dont watch TV that much, but perhaps i spent too much time starring at this idiot box trying to reply to your post by lowering my self to your level.

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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 05:07 PM
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for one, how is it short sighted, for two, after i've read your entire gibberish, i still didn't find how is it short sighted. so stop your internet bullying and learn some internet etiquette.
How is it short sighted? Because you know nothing of the shady dealings of the banks that were issuing these loans. They were selling, then shorting loans that didn't even exist (hadn't actually been issued), to get more money to package and sell more non-existent "sub prime" loans, to keep the bubble inflating. They then packaged these in to CDO's and other instruments and sold them as AAA rated stock. Fraud upon fraud, upon fraud. These banks, such as Goldman-Sachs knew that they were selling garbage mortgage securities and carried on doing so.



Quote:
did you even read the so-called proof you provided in your later post, it even said that the $24 Trillion is speculation and overly inflated. matter of fact, I think the pressing question is "CAN you even read". I understand the 1 trillion bailout lacks the transparency we would like to see, but inflating 2-3 trillion to 24 trillion seems to be witch hunt to me.
Yes, I read the article. Do some more research and you will see that there really is a 24 trillion credit line extended to these "too big to fail" banks, and your labor is the guarantee for this. Are you happy with the model of socializing the risk, while privatizing the profit?



Quote:
I dont know about you, but i am actually supporting the bailout. in case you have alzheimer's disease, let me refresh your memory. last year during October, congress rejected the 700 billion bailout bill for the first time. the stock market drop 700 points in one day.
Would you care to share these "facts" with me?

The process of bailing these banks out is only delaying the inevitable.

The fact remains that these banks are mostly insolvent and up to their eyes in massively leveraged debt.

The banks, along with insurance companies have actually bet, and made money on these loans failing.

Congress was terrorized by the Fed into passing that bill.



Quote:
is this from one of those mass e-mail again, talking about a state to state block party. if you actually do the number, this idea is full of sh!t. the numbers dont add up. plus 8 trillion is about 72% of our current national debt. to be honest, this got to be the stupidest thing I have heard on this subject. its like you are saying lets pile on another 72% more debt so the next few generations will get screw so we don't have to pay mortgage. BTW why would anyone want to spend money on someone's mortgage anyway.
No, its not. Why don't you look up the actual public debt figures?
For everything, mortgages, credit cards, auto loans etc etc etc, the figure is estimated at 9 Trillion for 2009.


Obviously, your reading comprehension isn't as great as you would think. Nor is your English.
I didn't say I think homeowners mortgages should be paid off by the government, I simply stated that it would be better than the money being stolen from the American people, and thrown into the Wall St black hole, just to make the inevitable crash even greater.

What's good for Wall St is not good for the American public. Somehow, you think Wall St profits are what makes the world go round. They aren't.
Goldman Sachs is posting great quarterly "profits", while over 1 million US jobs were lost in that same quarter.


Quote:
this I agreed with you, the Banks should not refuse to show where the money have gone. but on the other hand, our congress have open their mouth and said damaging things merit all the time.
Ummm... What? Are you using the Babelfish translator?


Quote:
what kind of backward logic is this? are you one of those "guns kill people not people kill people" kind of guy? just because you can borrow money in a amount that you are not able to pay back doesnt mean you should go borrow it. its the same thing as just because banks have money doesn't mean you have to go rob it. what ever happen to be responsible for your own actions, or accountability? is this what your parents have taught you? is this what you are teaching to your kids today? no wonder America is going down the sh!t hole.
There you go again, blaming the public. As said above, a vast percentage of these sub prime loans were never even loaned to physical people. They were "sold" then shorted to keep the bubble inflating.
Predatory lending practices and huge deregulation of lending laws and standards are what allowed these loans to be made. They were loaning people money that they CLEARLY knew could not pay them back. One story tells of a Mexican strawberry picker in California, who spoke no English and was earning $14000 a year, and was given every penny of a $720,000 loan to buy a house.
This is how crazy these lenders were. They totally abandoned sensible and ethical lending practices.


Quote:
derivatives are design to minimize risk, but individuals failed to act responsibility when they gamble against the unknown odds. I personally still don't see how the ultimate motive behind derivative is to reduce the stander of living as you put it though. once again, need proof.
Yeah, that's the official story. You're just repeating what the crooks on TV told you. It may have minimized risk for the Wall St banksters, but ended up screwing over almost everyone invested in the stock market. Because of this scam, banks and investment firms were able to leverage their derivatives to a grand (estimated max)total of around $1.5 Quadrillion (1,500 Trillion). The entire planet with everything on it does not even come close to covering this. It's a giant scam and everyone bought into it.
A giant transfer of wealth is occuring. Transfer of our wealth to the bankers. The currency is inflating due to massive debt creation, thus robbing savers/fixed income/fiscally responsible people of buying power.


Quote:
once again, where is the proof? show me how sub prime crises is not real, how counties around the globe is not being effected by it. if you can do that, I can show you how the $24 trillion really does exist. maybe you lived a shelter life, but I am certainly living an American dream. its not exactly fine and dandy as they shown in movies, but it sure is better than what could of happen if I didn't start a new life here.
I didn't say it wasn't real, but its small fries compared to the CDO's, CDS's and derivatives market as a whole. It just so happened that the sub-prime scam reared its ugly head before the rest of the financial scams did.

Look out for the commercial real estate collapse, coming soon to a city near you.

The funny thing is, you'll probably say "oh well, they over expanded too quickly. Tough luck." But then you're all for bailing out the criminals that facilitated it.
People with a far better grasp of economics than you or I are saying exactly what I am saying and have been warning of this coming crisis for years. Of course the wall street cheerleaders have scoffed at such suggestions and time and again have been proven dead wrong.









Quote:
I personally dont think they should be paid that much, but the reality is, their salary and bonuses are written in their contract and budgeted for. what happen to the lending crises is not 100% their fault. BTW show me how my bailout go directly to their pockets. because it is certain that their salary and bonuses is minute compare to the hundred billions they need to secure the bad assists.
That's not the point, fool. The point is, these idiots are being handsomely rewarded for defrauding their investors and the American taxpayer. If anyone other than a Wall St exec was involved in fraud of this nature, they would be behind bars by now. Bernie Madoff is just the tip of this giant iceberg.


Quote:
once again, there is another thread for conspiracy theories. so show some solid proof before you move your fingers. also please actually read the entire article before you post next time.
What does this even mean? Are you suggesting that conspiracies don't exist?


Quote:
this is the only claim that makes sense in this post, but how does this goes with being short sighted? you matter of fact just agreed with me on the fact that lending money to people is not the best actions right now. also perhaps the government didnt learned the lesson of selective borrowing, but it sure did learn something if what your claiming is true.
The lending practices of these banks have nothing to do with the government, unless you are talking about fannie mae and freddie mac (part of the problem). They are not scared of losing money, they are busy using the bailout money they were given, to make even more money for themselves.
They have even been allowed to mark to model (what they claim their investments are worth), rather than mark to market(what the actual market value is), which is one of the reasons these banks are showing good profits, when they are essentially bankrupt.

Another point to make is that these same banks are no longer issuing letters of credit to businesses that need to buy stock. It is not just mortgages that are involved here, it is also industry.

Also, your 2-3 trillion claim is way, way off. Where are you getting your information from? In 2008 Bloomberg were reporting that the pledged bailout had reached 7-8 Trillion.

Last edited by krisboro; 08-23-2009 at 05:12 PM.
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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 06:15 PM
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one bank that wasted the bailout money and the government did nothing to stop it was the buyout of national city by pnc bank. the bail out money was for bailing out the bank in trouble not the strong banks to buy out the struggling banks to make them self stronger. after the fact pnc bought out national city did the government step in and say since you bought out national city you have to shut down x number of banks. what happens to all those employees???? standing in line for unemployment.
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post #16 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 07:07 PM
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post #17 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 07:15 PM
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Damn you Krisboro... Thinking people actually need to know what's going on... you're just a terrorist!



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post #18 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 08:26 PM
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You're very welcome, sir.

If only ordinary people would get out of this left/right bs and quit worshipping the corrupt market, we might be able to fix things.

You are more than right with your evaluation in what is happening here, on more than 1 front, yet told to shut up, merely because you're not a US slave (rather a Canadian slave).
I'm not entirely sure how this makes your viewpoint any less worthwhile, but at least you didn't get banned. Right?
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post #19 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-23-2009, 08:46 PM
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Honestly, I want to punch this wu-dot-immigrant in the face. He knows nothing of this country and it's history, He knows zip-zero about what really happens on Wall St.
A true slave of the Wall St. bankers.
Learn our laws. Respect our laws. Don't waste your time defending a practice that is designed to take your wealth away.
READ!
Inform yourself and others.
Educate yourself.
Perhaps then, you may turn from a bootlicking Wall St whore, to a thinking person.

I'm prepared to argue this out until you literally don't have a pot to piss in. You will be proven to be wrong.
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post #20 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-24-2009, 12:17 AM
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You're very welcome, sir.

If only ordinary people would get out of this left/right bs and quit worshipping the corrupt market, we might be able to fix things.

You are more than right with your evaluation in what is happening here, on more than 1 front, yet told to shut up, merely because you're not a US slave (rather a Canadian slave).
I'm not entirely sure how this makes your viewpoint any less worthwhile, but at least you didn't get banned. Right?
I'm actually a dual Citizen slave. My grandparents (on my mother's side) are/were Americans, and My mother is dual citizen... and luckily that was passed on to me. I see myself as being fortunate because reality is I could have been born in Haiti or Zimbabwe just as easily.

Yea, I'm not so sure why people can't separate the message from the messenger. I guess it's just because people like to hear/believe whatever it is they know/want to hear... People enjoy hearing/knowing that they're the biggest/baddest/best at everything (even if they did absolutely nothing to earn it). When that's how you've been raised and that's all you've heard your entire life you don't question it. When someone tells you something that contradicts your core beliefs they almost always attack the messenger instead of trying to use logic to break down the arguments presented.

The biggest thing I don't understand is how so many Americans have been brainwashed into thinking that everything with the words "capitalism" and "free market" is inherently positive/good for them. They have no problem being fleeced/ripped off so long as it's in the name of the "free market". Americans have been tricked into voting against their best interest for many years now... Sure, you're making/saving a few more bucks on the front end (short-term) but what are you loosing on the back end (long-run)? You can only ignore the long term repercussions of your actions for so long before they catch up with you.

I do believe in ideas and principles of capitalism and the free market... but it's not truly free when a handful of elites own/control everything.
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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-24-2009, 05:23 PM
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Honestly, I want to punch this wu-dot-immigrant in the face. He knows nothing of this country and it's history, He knows zip-zero about what really happens on Wall St.
And you know what goes on because...? You work there and are exposing the corrupt corporate practice? You saw some conspiracy video on the internet? Give me a break.
Quote:
Learn our laws. Respect our laws.
Yea this I dont get. What law is he disrespecting? What law doesnt he know? I mean I know this tactic. To yell and scream REALLY loudly in order to get people to pay attention to you.
Quote:
Inform yourself and others.
Educate yourself.
Perhaps then, you may turn from a bootlicking Wall St whore, to a thinking person.
Yea cause the internet is THE place to do that. With all that great information
Quote:
I'm prepared to argue this out until you literally don't have a pot to piss in. You will be proven to be wrong.
Yea someone on here has this in their sig... Something about never arguing with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. Im just going to walk away, but I will leave you a tin foil hat though.

Very nice though. Lenin, Stalin, Obama and most importantly Saul Alinsky would be proud. Eviscerate the proletariat!!!

"Oh and if you dare say that I dont know whats it like get a freakin clue! I date models and strippers. So dont tell me that I dont know whats its like!" - BDiddy
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-24-2009, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Honestly, I want to punch this wu-dot-immigrant in the face. He knows nothing of this country and it's history, He knows zip-zero about what really happens on Wall St.
A true slave of the Wall St. bankers.
Learn our laws. Respect our laws. Don't waste your time defending a practice that is designed to take your wealth away.
READ!
Inform yourself and others.
Educate yourself.
Perhaps then, you may turn from a bootlicking Wall St whore, to a thinking person.

I'm prepared to argue this out until you literally don't have a pot to piss in. You will be proven to be wrong.
first of all, I am a US citizen, and lets not forget that your family were once immigrant too. so STFU.

second, learn your manners, but i guess a white trash (judging from location and our pass conversation) don't understand how to behave in public other than fuking your sisters.

third, take your own advise, lean about the truth otherwise STFU. most new immigrants whom become citizens know more about US on average than the natural born US citizens. we know, study, and care more about what happen in and out of US than most natural born US citizens. because we see things in a different perspective, we have a world view of things.

but after looking at most of your BS (with one ounce of truth), I begin to realize further debating with you would only lower my IQ.

BTW, learn from other good conversation examples of the political thd. we talk about issues, different ideas, not personal attacks which does nothing. perhaps you might learn a thing or two about respect where your parents have failed to teach you. i guess an apple never falls far from the tree; a hillbilly will always have another hillbilly.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
How is it short sighted? Because you know nothing of the shady dealings of the banks that were issuing these loans. They were selling, then shorting loans that didn't even exist (hadn't actually been issued), to get more money to package and sell more non-existent "sub prime" loans, to keep the bubble inflating. They then packaged these in to CDO's and other instruments and sold them as AAA rated stock. Fraud upon fraud, upon fraud. These banks, such as Goldman-Sachs knew that they were selling garbage mortgage securities and carried on doing so.
once again, the article you posted is more clams, no proof. there are no traceability to his clam, no evidence of any sorts is provided. dont get me wrong, i am not saying GS didnt do what the article says, but until a clear paper trail is establish that is beyond reasonable doubt, I would not call them fraud just yet.


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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Yes, I read the article. Do some more research and you will see that there really is a 24 trillion credit line extended to these "too big to fail" banks, and your labor is the guarantee for this. Are you happy with the model of socializing the risk, while privatizing the profit?
all Im saying is 24 trillion credit line extension is still speculation. the total bailout amount lacks the transparency for us to know the exact amount and where it went at this point. thought i do agreed with your point of "socializing the risk, while privatizing the profit", i however is holding my tongue until the dust have settle.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Would you care to share these "facts" with me?
http://www.money-zine.com/Investing/...Crash-of-2008/

if you were to pull the stock index around that week, its up and down like a roller coaster.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
The process of bailing these banks out is only delaying the inevitable.

The fact remains that these banks are mostly insolvent and up to their eyes in massively leveraged debt.

The banks, along with insurance companies have actually bet, and made money on these loans failing.

Congress was terrorized by the Fed into passing that bill.
I do agreed with the fact that we are delaying the inevitable. instead of feeling the brunt of the blow, we are taking it slowly in hoping that the damage is not enough to cripple the entire economy.

as far as leveraging debt and betting on loans to fail , the root cause of this situation all comes down to lack of individual accountability. if we are all responsible for our own actions, things like this wouldn't happen.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
No, its not. Why don't you look up the actual public debt figures?
For everything, mortgages, credit cards, auto loans etc etc etc, the figure is estimated at 9 Trillion for 2009.
Im only talking about the debt that is owe by our government, not everyone in the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Obviously, your reading comprehension isn't as great as you would think. Nor is your English.
I didn't say I think homeowners mortgages should be paid off by the government, I simply stated that it would be better than the money being stolen from the American people, and thrown into the Wall St black hole, just to make the inevitable crash even greater.
first i have never calmed my English is good. but i sure can read between the line. maybe your are right, perhaps i do need to get my eyes check again so i can understand the underlying message of what you are trying to say:
Quote:
8 trillion would have paid off everyone in the US's mortgage. That would have been a real stimulus, albeit a hideously socialistic one.
I'd rather the money go to the people, than a bunch of crooked fuckin elitist bankers.
you were talking about a stimulus package, and only the government gives stimulus package. maybe i am connecting the impossible dots here, because the logic of A=B, and B=C thus A=C doesn't seem to be true after all.

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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-24-2009, 08:27 PM
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What's good for Wall St is not good for the American public. Somehow, you think Wall St profits are what makes the world go round. They aren't.
Goldman Sachs is posting great quarterly "profits", while over 1 million US jobs were lost in that same quarter.
I am not going to wast my time arguing whats good for Wall st. nor do i clam i am a guru about all things goes on in Wall st. but i do know that if the stock indication does well, everyone does well. GS is one company, its not the representative of the entire situation. this is a weak argument, so im not even going to go on any further.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Ummm... What? Are you using the Babelfish translator?
no it was a wrong correction by the spell check. but my point is that the government get their food stuck in their mouth all the time.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
There you go again, blaming the public. As said above, a vast percentage of these sub prime loans were never even loaned to physical people. They were "sold" then shorted to keep the bubble inflating.
Predatory lending practices and huge deregulation of lending laws and standards are what allowed these loans to be made. They were loaning people money that they CLEARLY knew could not pay them back. One story tells of a Mexican strawberry picker in California, who spoke no English and was earning $14000 a year, and was given every penny of a $720,000 loan to buy a house.
This is how crazy these lenders were. They totally abandoned sensible and ethical lending practices.
what i am doing is not blaming, but rather finding the root cause of an issue. first of all, like i said before, show me the paper trail that indicates "sub prime loans were never even loaned to physical people". simply posting some columnist's opinion w/o reference is not good enough; people at US weekly does that.

second. cracking down on lending policy will only address the symptoms instead of addressing the issues. if there is a loop hole, people will find it, people will exploit it. the only root cause correction is to slowly reinstalled a sense of individual accountability.

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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Yeah, that's the official story. You're just repeating what the crooks on TV told you. It may have minimized risk for the Wall St banksters, but ended up screwing over almost everyone invested in the stock market. Because of this scam, banks and investment firms were able to leverage their derivatives to a grand (estimated max)total of around $1.5 Quadrillion (1,500 Trillion). The entire planet with everything on it does not even come close to covering this. It's a giant scam and everyone bought into it.
A giant transfer of wealth is occuring. Transfer of our wealth to the bankers. The currency is inflating due to massive debt creation, thus robbing savers/fixed income/fiscally responsible people of buying power.
this begin to sounds like a broken record, but show us some proof. traceability is the key, not someone's opinion without back up. I need facts and figures that are backed by real data. those data need to be accessible to the public and referenceable through various sources. most importently, the numbers got to add up


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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
I didn't say it wasn't real, but its small fries compared to the CDO's, CDS's and derivatives market as a whole. It just so happened that the sub-prime scam reared its ugly head before the rest of the financial scams did.
Look out for the commercial real estate collapse, coming soon to a city near you.
this far, I've seen the direct impact with the sub prime crises, where the housing development stop at its track, and housing prices falls trough the floor. but i have yet to see the CDO's, CDS's and derivative impacts as server as you say it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
The funny thing is, you'll probably say "oh well, they over expanded too quickly. Tough luck." But then you're all for bailing out the criminals that facilitated it.
People with a far better grasp of economics than you or I are saying exactly what I am saying and have been warning of this coming crisis for years. Of course the wall street cheerleaders have scoffed at such suggestions and time and again have been proven dead wrong.
i dont disagreed with you that our current financial situation was a total surprise. the war, the lending practice, the hyper inflation in the housing prices, are all indications. however, it doesn't take a genius to tell you that building our financial institution and policys on shaky foundation will lead to its ultimate collapse. but with the given situation at the time of oct 2008. passing the bailout is one of the best options to the containment of the situation.


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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
That's not the point, fool. The point is, these idiots are being handsomely rewarded for defrauding their investors and the American taxpayer. If anyone other than a Wall St exec was involved in fraud of this nature, they would be behind bars by now. Bernie Madoff is just the tip of this giant iceberg.
first of all, how am i a fool, show my by pointing faults in the information that i provide. show me how they are the sole responsible party for the collapse of the system. back to my point, individual accountability is needed for every citizen of the US is the root correction of this issue. being a true american is to know what is right when everything else is wrong. that is why the founding fathers decided to leave England and live here. they take the actions upon them self to make their country a better place, they make them self accountable for the things they do. somehow over time, many natural US born citizen like you tend to forget the facts. instead you learned how to point fingers at everyone else but take a good look at your self. the reality is, we all need to take a good look at ourselves first before we start to question others.


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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
What does this even mean? Are you suggesting that conspiracies don't exist?
go read the quote again, it was a statement to your clam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
The lending practices of these banks have nothing to do with the government, unless you are talking about fannie mae and freddie mac (part of the problem). They are not scared of losing money, they are busy using the bailout money they were given, to make even more money for themselves.
They have even been allowed to mark to model (what they claim their investments are worth), rather than mark to market(what the actual market value is), which is one of the reasons these banks are showing good profits, when they are essentially bankrupt.

Another point to make is that these same banks are no longer issuing letters of credit to businesses that need to buy stock. It is not just mortgages that are involved here, it is also industry.
the lending practices have everything to do with the government policy. if the government says lend to the risky people, every bank is going to jump on the bandwagon. though fannie mae and freddie mac are just two company that don't even directly deal with loans, they are at the top of the mortgage food chain. as a result, every banks is going to sale whey they want to buy.
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Originally Posted by krisboro View Post
Also, your 2-3 trillion claim is way, way off. Where are you getting your information from? In 2008 Bloomberg were reporting that the pledged bailout had reached 7-8 Trillion.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aZchK__XUF84

from the same bloomberg site, the current ammount is 3.8 trillion. though its more than what i said, it is still half of what you suggest. what i cared about is what is the reality, not the possibility.

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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-24-2009, 08:30 PM
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And you know what goes on because...? You work there and are exposing the corrupt corporate practice? You saw some conspiracy video on the internet? Give me a break.

Yea this I dont get. What law is he disrespecting? What law doesnt he know? I mean I know this tactic. To yell and scream REALLY loudly in order to get people to pay attention to you.

Yea cause the internet is THE place to do that. With all that great information

Yea someone on here has this in their sig... Something about never arguing with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. Im just going to walk away, but I will leave you a tin foil hat though.

Very nice though. Lenin, Stalin, Obama and most importantly Saul Alinsky would be proud. Eviscerate the proletariat!!!
thank you.. I couldn't said it better myself.

while we are trying to have a decent discussion here, this troll comes around and start flinging mud all over the place. but i guess the serious players like us will always follow the unwritten rules of attacking the issue not the person; unless you were attack first.

RIP Phatty

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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-26-2009, 11:39 PM
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And you know what goes on because...? You work there and are exposing the corrupt corporate practice? You saw some conspiracy video on the internet? Give me a break.
I know what? That Wall St and the Government are lying to us?
Uhm.
Yes.


Quote:
Yea this I dont get. What law is he disrespecting? What law doesnt he know? I mean I know this tactic. To yell and scream REALLY loudly in order to get people to pay attention to you.
You clearly do know this method, however, you are lacking ANY FACTS to back up your un-educated assertions.

Quote:
Yea cause the internet is THE place to do that. With all that great information
Ha, and the newspapers and TV news are the place to go to find the Holy Grail? Give me a fuckin break...

Quote:
Yea someone on here has this in their sig... Something about never arguing with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. Im just going to walk away, but I will leave you a tin foil hat though.
I guess I should probably have followed this advice

Quote:
Very nice though. Lenin, Stalin, Obama and most importantly Saul Alinsky would be proud. Eviscerate the proletariat!!!
Uhhhhh......What?

Tell me what you know about the history of Alinsky, Stalin and Lenin. You read any good books on them? Let me know how far your education goes (outside of watching television).
See, if you had even half the brain you think you do, you wouldn't be talking such bullshit to me. I am anything but a fuckin commie/leftist (speaking in neanderthal language you understand).
Would you care to point out and show me how I am wrong(with evidence, of course - not rhetoric)? How I'm wrong that the US has been robbed blind.
How about you explain how bailing out so-called free market banks, so said banks can make more money, while repossessing your house, car, tv?
Explain how usury debt is a good thing. Explain why you think these degenerate banks deserve your money.
If you think a bunch of kleptocrats getting rich and reducing your standard of living is a good thing, then go ahead and knock yourself out; just don't try and get involved in a conversation where we are talking about more than dumb ass, knee-jerk reactionary bullshit.

I will re-iterate it for you. I am pro free market. Pro capitalism. Pro freedom.

I am just not pro-crook, pro-criminal, pro-lies, pro-reduction in my standard of living, pro-government.

Can I be any clearer on my position?

Last edited by krisboro; 08-27-2009 at 12:19 PM.
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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 09-02-2009, 11:01 PM
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The $531 Trillion Dollar Derivatives Time Bomb *

Wise Up Journal / Sovereign Independent - Sept/Oct issue, page 12
01.09.2009
By Gabriel O’Hara

Titanic Derivatives

What are derivatives? Some investors describe them as “dormant economic weapons of mass destruction”. They essentially are large leveraged bets on top of stocks, bonds and commodities. Money can be made within months or seconds by betting if a stock will go up, down or even remain the same. With no credit rating you can place a bet worth double your account balance. Big time investors get greater leverage with these instantaneous loans.

The New York Times, Oct 8th 2008: “The derivatives market is $531 trillion, up from $106 trillion in 2002″. This market is setup with odds similar to a racetrack. Trillions are won and lost (transferred) every second. But unlike a racetrack the big players have ultimate control. Their trillions can make stocks move. A 4% up swing in a stock can cause a derivative bet to rise more than 100% in value or vice versa. A low performing stock that rises only 6% a year could actually have many 3, 6 or 9 percent swings weekly or monthly (some stocks daily). There are billions to be made over and over again by the people that control billions and trillions thus the markets. A grand game approved by the top.

The globe’s GDP is at $60.1 trillion. The globe’s total financial assets were reported as $167 trillion in 2006. A few trillion lower today no doubt. The highly volatile derivatives market is worth noting because it dwarfs the entire world’s GDP and total financial assets combined.

Alan Greenspan, the former long-term chairman of the central bank of the United States, constantly double-spoke over his career. He made statements that the current unchanged derivatives market is the best thing since sliced-money and occasionally he gave dire warnings. On May 9th 2003 the New York Times published the following: “Mr. Greenspan, as he has done in the past, praised derivatives, saying their benefits materially outweighed the risks and had insulated the financial system from the stock market crash and economic downturn.” New York Times, Oct 8th 2008: “Mr. Greenspan warned that derivatives could amplify crises because they tied together the fortunes of many seemingly independent institutions. ‘The very efficiency that is involved here means that if a crisis were to occur, that that crisis is transmitted at a far faster pace and with some greater virulence,’ he said.” With double-speak Greenspan can always be “right” in his autobiography. Historians can choose if he was one of the “experts” giving warnings or they can put the blame on him. Quite often the qualified “experts” that helped crash a system are the ones in charge of building the next system.

The $531 trillion dollars derivatives market contains a mind-boggling amount of high-risk credit in the hands of a small few that could completely finish off the collapse of the current global economy (for a new global replacement). New York Times, May 9th 2003: “he detailed the potential dangers to financial markets if a big derivatives dealer had to exit the market. In his speech, delivered to the conference by satellite, Mr. Greenspan said that a single dealer accounts for about a third of the global market in both interest rate and credit derivatives, and a few dealers account for more than two-thirds.”

Playing with people’s lives

The span between the green-cash haves and have-nots grew larger under Greenspan. The majority of people around the world rely on the economy for their livelihoods. But what runs the integrated global economy? Credit!

Greenspan is not one of the minority with trillions of dollars, and trillions more in credit, tied in derivatives. His work was benefiting the dominant minority of the market. Those who own the gold get others to make their rules. If everything runs on money and you own the money, it’s easy to run things.

The new financial system is currently being openly discussed, if not already fully constructed on paper. Have no doubt that the paid “experts” will be given plenty of corporate and government media time sprouting how wonderful the new system will be for the ordinary man while saying enough bad things about the old system to keep us happy or they might even put the blame on the “greedy public”. A few bank employees (bank managers) have already been scarified in the media. Of course, the real economic managers, the top bank owners, will create the new system. The same people that profited from the sheering of the current system. The trillion dollar banking families of the globe don’t want to end their river of wealth, making easy money from the public, which means the World Bank and the European Central Bank don’t what that either. The current system would be updated with desired regulations (a better game for a few) and new banking language that the general public don’t understand, like with any good con. However, not until after some turmoil as turmoil is needed for large-scale changes to be accepted. As the EU Commission President, Manuel Barroso, said, “the kind of occasion where the crisis calls in to question all certainties and minds are more open to change, these are very special moments.” A spokesperson for the upcoming system, Gordon Brown, said all that the nation bankrupting bailouts and social chaos are “the difficult birth pangs of a new global order” and the expert’s “task now is nothing less than making the transition to a new internationalism,” reported by the Daily Mail on Jan 27th 2008. This is what happens when people desire to be managed.

Who runs what?

What did Milton Friedman, a Nobel Prize winning economist, have to say about the track record of the central bank in the United States? He said, “the Federal Reserve definitely caused the Great depression by contracting the amount of currency in circulation by one-third from 1929 to 1933.” Contracting or inflating the money supply are only two tools among many utilised by central banks to direct economies.

No individual running the European Central Bank are elected by the public, they are hand picked, and no EU institution has authority over the decisions of the ECB. The ECB is an independent corporate entity. Article 106.2 of the EU’s 1992 Maastricht treaty states, “the ECB shall have legal personality”. Article 107 says the ECB and national central banks are totally independent from member state governments and “any other body” including the EU. It even forbids “the community of institutions and bodies” and “any government of a Member State or from any other body” from instructing or advising the ECB and national central banks. Article 108.2 allows the ECB to publish or withhold any or all information on decision-making. As we all know, the ECB have the “EXCLUSIVE right to AUTHORIZE the issue of bank notes within the Community.”

Although acquitted, the European Central Bank President, Jean-Claude Trichet, was on trial with eight others for his part in signing off official accounts during a time of fraud at one of France’s biggest banks (Credit Lyonnais) which resulted in a €31 billion Euro bailout. The “right” kind of people always seems to get picked for the top.

On June 25th 2007 while everyone was happy with the booming economy the Telegraph published that the Bank for International Settlements’, the ultimate bank of all central banks, 77th annual report talked of a coming global depression. The people behind this bank don’t have crystal balls. They are the movers and shakers that make things happen. Great depressions (great for some) create fantastic discounts for those with credit and bust those “nasty” competitors, especially the many small family run competitors. Since Sept 2007 billions of national emergency funds have been injected in to the global financial markets keeping buyers for the large sellers. Bank stocks lost almost 50% of their value by Dec 2007. The 6 o’clock news did not tell people about the credit crash until late 2008. Wait until the derivatives bubble - in the hands of a small few - pops, then we’ll have a brand new global financial architecture and it certainly won’t be good for the people if we allow the crisis creators to build it.

Removal of control over people’s livelihoods and lives is needed for once.
Go here for hyperlinks to EVIDENCED claims: http://www.wiseupjournal.com/?p=1096

More conspiracy theories....
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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 09-03-2009, 11:29 PM
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 09-04-2009, 11:24 PM
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What did Milton Friedman, a Nobel Prize winning economist, have to say about the track record of the central bank in the United States? He said, “the Federal Reserve definitely caused the Great depression by contracting the amount of currency in circulation by one-third from 1929 to 1933.” Contracting or inflating the money supply are only two tools among many utilised by central banks to direct economies.

Quote:
I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing
armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of
their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations
that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until
their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.
The issuing
power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly
belongs.

—Thomas Jefferson, 1802
Ahahahahaha 1802. 1802 is when he said that.

The derivatives "allowed markets to be opened up and lowered the risk" LOLOLOL!!!! Yes, yes, the certainly did, didn't they.

Hey, the Chinese aren't dumb.....

Quote:
WRAPUP 1-US commodities rattled by China derivatives stance
Mon Aug 31, 2009 5:07pm EDT

* China lets state firms default on derivative contracts- report

* US soy, gold and cotton pressured by report

* Lawyers doubt legal standing of the move

* Market suspects more potential losses prompt the move

* Foreign banks dismayed (Updates with US gold, soy and cotton markets weighed down by reported move; adds analyst quotes, adds CHICAGO to dateline)

By Eadie Chen and Chen Aizhu

BEIJING/CHICAGO, Aug 31 (Reuters) - U.S. gold and soybean markets fell on Monday following a weekend report that China's state companies may default on commodity derivative contracts with banks providing over-the-counter hedging services.

Traders in other commodities markets in the United States were cautious, underscoring China's predominance as a buyer in global markets from metals to grain to oil after it played a key role in rallying prices to record highs last year.

In a measure of the country's influence over the global economy, U.S. stocks fell after the Shanghai Composite index .SSEC fell nearly 7 percent to a three-month low on fears Beijing is trying to moderate growth and choke off speculation in its stock market by tightening bank lending.

Commodities markets were chilled by a report in Caijing magazine quoting an unnamed industry source as saying Chinese state-owned companies will be allowed to default on commodity derivative contracts. The report provoked anger and dismay among investment banks that feared a damaging precedent.

China's regulator of state owned enterprises, the Assets Supervision and Administration Commission (SASAC), has told six foreign banks that SOEs reserved the right to default on contracts, the magazine said in an article published on Saturday.

A government official said that the Bureau of Financial Supervision and Evaluation under SASAC was handling the issue. The official declined to be named and did not elaborate.

"A Chinese agency said they reserve the right to walk away from bad derivatives contracts and that stirred up a lot of worry not only about the stock market but soybeans as well," said Paul Haugens, vice president at Newedge USA.

China, the world's top importer of soybeans, has been an aggressive buyer of U.S. supplies, helping drive prices higher as stockpiles fell to the lowest level in over three decades.

US SOY, GOLD MARKETS FALL, COTTON RECOVERS

Chicago Board of Trade soybean futures for November delivery SX9 fell 31-1/2 cents, or 3 percent, to $9.79-1/2.

December gold GCZ9 fell $5.30 to $953.50 an ounce at the New York Mercantile Exchange's COMEX division. U.S. cotton futures fell in early trading due to the news, but closed higher on month-end position squaring.

"Historically, it is not so unusual for China to either renegotiate or abandon some deals that have been made. Some traders who have been around for a while are certainly aware of that possibility," said Bill O'Neill, managing partner at New Jersey-based LOGIC Advisors.

Spokespersons at Goldman Sachs (GS.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), UBS (UBSN.VX: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), JPMorgan (JPM.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) and Morgan Stanley declined to comment, along with the Securities Industry and Financial Markets Association and International Swaps and Derivatives Association Inc.

The reported letter to the six banks follows an order from SASAC in July that required all state companies trading in derivatives to make quarterly reports about their investments, including details of holdings and performance.

"I won't be surprised if more state firms emerged with big derivatives trading losses. Or else SASAC won't come out with such a radical move," a Hong Kong-based derivatives analyst said.

"As far as I know, there are another number of state firms bogged down in such losses besides those surfaced ones," said the analyst, who declined to be named due to the sensitivity of the issue.

'ABNORMAL PRACTICE'

A SASAC media official said he was waiting for the "relevant department's" official comment before clarifying the situation with the media.

The report deals another blow to investment banks hoping to sell more derivatives hedges in China, the world's fastest-expanding major economy and top commodities consumer.

"It's a handful of companies who are being encouraged by regulators to renegotiate. It's outrageous, but it's China so everyone is treading very carefully," said a banking source.

Beijing-based derivatives lawyers said the so-called "legal letter" has no legal standing -- SASAC as a shareholder of SOEs has no business relationship with international banks.

"This can also lead to market chaos. For example, a foreign bank can tell its Chinese clients that it can reserve the right to default on contracts that will bring losses to the bank," said a lawyer from the derivatives risks committee of the Beijing Lawyers Association.

No bank names were reported in the Caijing report. The SASAC media officer also declined to specify any.

Chinese state firms, especially those that have suffered big losses in derivatives trading, have been complaining that their foreign banks sometimes did not disclose full information of potential risks when selling them complicated products.

For a factbox of China's derivatives debacles: [ID:nPEK206094] (Reporting by Eadie Chen and Chen Aizhu in Beijing, Alfred Cang in Shanghai, George Chen and Michael Flaherty in Hong Kong, Sam Nelson in Chicago and Carole Vaporean and Steve Eder in New York. Writing by K.T. Arasu, Eadie Chen and Chen Aizhu; editing by Jim Marshall)
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Read More: Financial Bailout, Glass-Steagall Act, Goldman Sachs, Matt Taibbi, National Strike, Obama Financial Bailout, Shays’ Rebellion, Politics News

The American government -- which we once called our government -- has been taken over by Wall Street, the mega-corporations and the super-rich. They are the ones who decide our fate. It is this group of powerful elites, the people President Franklin D. Roosevelt called "economic royalists," who choose our elected officials -- indeed, our very form of government. Both Democrats and Republicans dance to the tune of their corporate masters. In America, corporations do not control the government. In America, corporations are the government.

This was never more obvious than with the Wall Street bailout, whereby the very corporations that caused the collapse of our economy were rewarded with taxpayer dollars. So arrogant, so smug were they that, without a moment's hesitation, they took our money -- yours and mine -- to pay their executives multimillion-dollar bonuses, something they continue doing to this very day. They have no shame. They don't care what you and I think about them. Henry Kissinger refers to us as "useless eaters."

But, you say, we have elected a candidate of change. To which I respond: Do these words of President Obama sound like change?

"A culture of irresponsibility took root, from Wall Street to Washington to Main Street."
There it is. Right there. We are Main Street. We must, according to our president, share the blame. He went on to say: "And a regulatory regime basically crafted in the wake of a 20th-century economic crisis -- the Great Depression -- was overwhelmed by the speed, scope and sophistication of a 21st-century global economy."

This is nonsense.

The reason Wall Street was able to game the system the way it did -- knowing that they would become rich at the expense of the American people (oh, yes, they most certainly knew that) -- was because the financial elite had bribed our legislators to roll back the protections enacted after the Stock Market Crash of 1929.

Congress gutted the Glass-Steagall Act, which separated commercial lending banks from investment banks, and passed the Commodity Futures Modernization Act, which allowed for self-regulation with no oversight. The Securities and Exchange Commission subsequently revised its rules to allow for even less oversight -- and we've all seen how well that worked out. To date, no serious legislation has been offered by the Obama administration to correct these problems.

Instead, Obama wants to increase the oversight power of the Federal Reserve. Never mind that it already had significant oversight power before our most recent economic meltdown, yet failed to take action. Never mind that the Fed is not a government agency but a cartel of private bankers that cannot be held accountable by Washington. Whatever the Fed does with these supposed new oversight powers will be behind closed doors.

Obama's failure to act sends one message loud and clear: He cannot stand up to the powerful Wall Street interests that supplied the bulk of his campaign money for the 2008 election. Nor, for that matter, can Congress, for much the same reason.

Consider what multibillionaire banker David Rockefeller wrote in his 2002 memoirs:

"Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure -- one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it."



Read Rockefeller's words again. He actually admits to working against the "best interests of the United States."


Need more? Here's what Rockefeller said in 1994 at a U.N. dinner: "We are on the verge of a global transformation. All we need is the right major crisis, and the nations will accept the New World Order." They're gaming us. Our country has been stolen from us.

Journalist Matt Taibbi, writing in Rolling Stone, notes that esteemed economist John Kenneth Galbraith laid the 1929 crash at the feet of banking giant Goldman Sachs. Taibbi goes on to say that Goldman Sachs has been behind every other economic downturn as well, including the most recent one. As if that wasn't enough, Goldman Sachs even had a hand in pushing gas prices up to $4 a gallon.

The problem with bankers is longstanding. Here's what one of our Founding Fathers, Thomas Jefferson, had to say about them:

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their father's conquered."


We all know that the first American Revolution officially began in 1776, with the Declaration of Independence. Less well known is that the single strongest motivating factor for revolution was the colonists' attempt to free themselves from the Bank of England. But how many of you know about the second revolution, referred to by historians as Shays' Rebellion? It took place in 1786-87, and once again the banks were the cause. This time they were putting the screws to America's farmers.

Daniel Shays was a farmer in western Massachusetts. Like many other farmers of the day, he was being driven into bankruptcy by the banks' predatory lending practices. (Sound familiar?) Rallying other farmers to his side, Shays led his rebels in an attack on the courts and the local armory. The rebellion itself failed, but a message had been sent: The bankers (and the politicians who supported them) ultimately backed off. As Thomas Jefferson famously quipped in regard to the insurrection: "A little rebellion now and then is a good thing. The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

Perhaps it's time to consider that option once again.

I'm calling for a national strike, one designed to close the country down for a day. The intent? Real campaign-finance reform and strong restrictions on lobbying. Because nothing will change until we take corporate money out of politics. Nothing will improve until our politicians are once again answerable to their constituents, not the rich and powerful.

Let's set a date. No one goes to work. No one buys anything. And if that isn't effective -- if the politicians ignore us -- we do it again. And again. And again.

The real war is not between the left and the right. It is between the average American and the ruling class. If we come together on this single issue, everything else will resolve itself. It's time we took back our government from those who would make us their slaves.
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Oh, and fark Zeitgeist.

"Oh, you don't want a NWO? how about our flavor of NWO? It's really awesome. Honest!"

Bunch of inaccurate, mainly stolen work.
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