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post #1 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-14-2012, 01:38 PM Thread Starter
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Thoughts on vp candidate Ryan

I didn't know too much about him but from what I've researched on him I've liked. Any thoughts from our members here on him?


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post #2 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 01:29 PM
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I know this, he blasted the stimulus as wasteful, but then asked for millions of dollars from it, saying that it would help to create thousands of jobs in his state. He also has blasted the affordable care act for cutting money from Medicaid when his party is clamoring for cuts to such programs, and while his budget plan would gut Medicaid of billions of dollars.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...yndication=rss

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post #3 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 03:36 PM
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Personally, I REALLY like Paul Ryan. He's very forward, blunt and tells you how he feels. No pandering, no BS, just the facts.

Granted, he (like everyone) has somethings in his past and voting record that I don't like, but he's FAR better than our current administration.

And he counters all but one thing that bothered me about Romney. So I am 100% for the Romney/Ryan ticket now!


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post #4 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 04:48 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Niner1000RR View Post
Personally, I REALLY like Paul Ryan. He's very forward, blunt and tells you how he feels. No pandering, no BS, just the facts.

Granted, he (like everyone) has somethings in his past and voting record that I don't like, but he's FAR better than our current administration.

And he counters all but one thing that bothered me about Romney. So I am 100% for the Romney/Ryan ticket now!
I agree. From the research I've done I agree. I'm gonna look into becks stuff


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post #5 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 04:52 PM
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He is the only shining light in the upcoming election for me.
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post #6 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jbeck View Post
I know this, he blasted the stimulus as wasteful, but then asked for millions of dollars from it, saying that it would help to create thousands of jobs in his state. He also has blasted the affordable care act for cutting money from Medicaid when his party is clamoring for cuts to such programs, and while his budget plan would gut Medicaid of billions of dollars.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...yndication=rss
On your medicare claims, the Romney/Ryan plan does NOT gut medicare. You need to look at the actual facts. Try to get your info from the source, not a 3rd party news group that has a bias.

If you leave medicare, medicaid and social security the way they are, they are completely dissolved!

Medicare is completely bankrupt in under 12 years. At the current spending rates they estimate it could be less than 8 years by next year.

Medicaid was something like 15 years, don't quote me because I don't have the actual data in front of me.

Social security is reported (by the CBO) to be bankrupt in 2033 (or sooner depending on spending level, inflation, etc...).

So it's let them completely dissolve, OR try to fix them.

Which do you prefer?


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post #7 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 05:50 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Niner1000RR View Post
On your medicare claims, the Romney/Ryan plan does NOT gut medicare. You need to look at the actual facts. Try to get your info from the source, not a 3rd party news group that has a bias.

If you leave medicare, medicaid and social security the way they are, they are completely dissolved!

Medicare is completely bankrupt in under 12 years. At the current spending rates they estimate it could be less than 8 years by next year.

Medicaid was something like 15 years, don't quote me because I don't have the actual data in front of me.

Social security is reported (by the CBO) to be bankrupt in 2033 (or sooner depending on spending level, inflation, etc...).

So it's let them completely dissolve, OR try to fix them.

Which do you prefer?
Yup with you on this. Jbeck did what I did on the homeowners tax. Got 3rd party info. I was right on some stuff but the site I linked had false statements. Very similar thing to what I did jbeck.


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post #8 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Niner1000RR View Post
On your medicare claims, the Romney/Ryan plan does NOT gut medicare. You need to look at the actual facts. Try to get your info from the source, not a 3rd party news group that has a bias.

If you leave medicare, medicaid and social security the way they are, they are completely dissolved!

Medicare is completely bankrupt in under 12 years. At the current spending rates they estimate it could be less than 8 years by next year.

Medicaid was something like 15 years, don't quote me because I don't have the actual data in front of me.

Social security is reported (by the CBO) to be bankrupt in 2033 (or sooner depending on spending level, inflation, etc...).

So it's let them completely dissolve, OR try to fix them.

Which do you prefer?
If you look above, I only mentioned Medicaid. And I'm not saying that they don't need fixing. I only pointed out that he blasted "Obamacare" for making some cuts while trying to fix it, but then his plan would basically do the same thing. The difference, the Ryan plan would give states a block grant with an annual cap that would be adjusted to population growth and inflation. I don't know about you, but last I checked, the cost of healthcare was going up by more than inflation. Not only that, but basing increases on population growth is just dumb. If the population goes down, there would be less money for that state for Medicaid. Since when is poverty tied to population?

Oh, and no one commented on him requesting federal funds from a program that he called wasteful.


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Yup with you on this. Jbeck did what I did on the homeowners tax. Got 3rd party info. I was right on some stuff but the site I linked had false statements. Very similar thing to what I did jbeck.


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The story I linked to had nothing to do with Medicaid, Medicare, or SS.

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post #9 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 06:53 PM
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Yup with you on this. Jbeck did what I did on the homeowners tax. Got 3rd party info. I was right on some stuff but the site I linked had false statements. Very similar thing to what I did jbeck.


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It's actually what most people do. It's understandable, I mean it's much easier to listen to what someone is willing to tell you than to try to search it out from the various sources.

That goes for anything, whether it's budgets, bills, laws, taxes, revenue, unemployment rate, etc... It's easier to get the info from a news website than it is from the administration that publishes it.

I mean you can get it all at one spot instead of several.

But that means you have to take it with a grain of salt, because EVERYTHING comes with a slant. The further down the line you get your info the more slants can be applied to it.

Go straight to the source!


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post #10 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 06:56 PM
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It's actually what most people do. It's understandable, I mean it's much easier to listen to what someone is willing to tell you than to try to search it out from the various sources.

That goes for anything, whether it's budgets, bills, laws, taxes, revenue, unemployment rate, etc... It's easier to get the info from a news website than it is from the administration that publishes it.

I mean you can get it all at one spot instead of several.

But that means you have to take it with a grain of salt, because EVERYTHING comes with a slant. The further down the line you get your info the more slants can be applied to it.

Go straight to the source!
So where did you get your posted information above? I seen no sources for your information.

Also, it's funny that your trying to bash me for something that I did not do.

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post #11 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 06:59 PM
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If you look above, I only mentioned Medicaid. And I'm not saying that they don't need fixing. I only pointed out that he blasted "Obamacare" for making some cuts while trying to fix it, but then his plan would basically do the same thing. The difference, the Ryan plan would give states a block grant with an annual cap that would be adjusted to population growth and inflation. I don't know about you, but last I checked, the cost of healthcare was going up by more than inflation. Not only that, but basing increases on population growth is just dumb. If the population goes down, there would be less money for that state for Medicaid. Since when is poverty tied to population?

Oh, and no one commented on him requesting federal funds from a program that he called wasteful.
Correct sir, you only mentioned Medicaid, but they are all in the same boat. Every single one of them.

And he blasted PPACA for a long list of VALID reasons, not just the cutting of funds to Medicare. $716 billion dollars worth.

The difference between them is what they funds do once cut. In PPACA they are used to cover increase costs to the general healthcare fund. Done while mandating the state increase the roll to the program (which was struck down by SCOTUS). Where as the Ryan plan didn't spend the funds elsewhere.

But this really doesn't matter as he's acknowledged that we, the people, didn't like that. And they have a new revised plan that puts that fund back in Medicare.

And as far as the remaining system, you don't have to take part in the voucher system. You can chose to remain in the existing system if you want, it's YOUR option.

And that only applies to people 54 and younger, everyone else doesn't get touched at all.

But, since you are demonizing the Ryan proposal, you apparently think we should stick with the "Obama way?"


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post #12 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 07:02 PM
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And that only applies to people 54 and younger, everyone else doesn't get touched at all.

But, since you are demonizing the Ryan proposal, you apparently think we should stick with the "Obama way?"
If it's such a good plan, then why do they have to keep telling seniors that it's not going to affect them, just younger people?

And what is the "Obama way"? I didn't know he created medicaid.
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post #13 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 07:04 PM
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post #14 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 07:05 PM
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So where did you get your posted information above? I seen no sources for your information.

Also, it's funny that your trying to bash me for something that I did not do.
My information on the Ryan plan is from the Ryan bill, I have it on my iPad. The original, not the revised. I don't think they have released it yet. Ryan said he wanted to have more open discussions about it before including any more details.

Do you need a copy of the Ryan plan? Shoot me your e-mail and I will send it to you.

Happily.

And I wasn't trying to bash you, I apologize if it came off that way, I didn't intend it that way. Just expressed that everyone should get their info from the source.

Oh and you asked about people not commenting on the topic about taking funds from a plan he bashed. If you were a congressman of a district, and you voted against a bill but it passed anyway which had billions in earmarks, would you not attempt to at least try to salvage some of it for your district?

Makes perfect sense to me. I don't want it spent, but if your going to spend it on anything I am going to try to use it to the best of my abilities. And try to fight it again on the next vote.


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post #15 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 07:14 PM
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Oh and you asked about people not commenting on the topic about taking funds from a plan he bashed. If you were a congressman of a district, and you voted against a bill but it passed anyway which had billions in earmarks, would you not attempt to at least try to salvage some of it for your district?

Makes perfect sense to me. I don't want it spent, but if your going to spend it on anything I am going to try to use it to the best of my abilities. And try to fight it again on the next vote.
Not if it's something I ran against and am fundamentally against, which he is/was. That's a pretty major flaw with politicians these days. Say your against something, but then clamor for it for personal gain (re-election anyone). Especially when it comes to money and you run on a platform of cutting spending.
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post #16 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 07:41 PM
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post #17 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 08:14 PM
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Not if it's something I ran against and am fundamentally against, which he is/was. That's a pretty major flaw with politicians these days. Say your against something, but then clamor for it for personal gain (re-election anyone). Especially when it comes to money and you run on a platform of cutting spending.
And you're absolutely entitled to that. But, you also have to remember that your constituents paid their taxes into that money that's being handed out. If you're my representative and my money goes to another district, we are going to have issues.

First I want it in my pocket (as in don't take it from me) but if that fails, you better bring it home.

We are both entitled to our opinions. And I respect yours AND understand your point of view.


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post #18 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 08:14 PM
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That was AWESOME! I still have that saved on my DVR. :)


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post #19 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 10:52 PM Thread Starter
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paul ryan ftw. wish he was the primary but ill go with mitt. hope they can fix alot of this huge mess

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post #20 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-15-2012, 11:00 PM
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paul ryan ftw. wish he was the primary but ill go with mitt. hope they can fix alot of this huge mess
Yep, once again, the ticket is upside down. Ryan is the next regan!

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post #21 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 06:37 AM
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Yep, once again, the ticket is upside down. Ryan is the next regan!
+1, I too wish it were the other way around, but I'll take it. Finally someone who is will to tell us the truth! Tell us what we need to hear. No BS.

If they win, it will tell other candidates that this is what 'the people' want. That could be huge for our future. It will tell candidates that we WILL hold you accountable. Combine that with other wins like Scott Walker and others.

It could be a change.... I sure hope so!


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If it's such a good plan, then why do they have to keep telling seniors that it's not going to affect them, just younger people?
Because the Obama campaign is running ads saying that he is going to end medicare. But PLEASE don't take my word for it, go look at the Obama campaign's website. You'll see quotes like the ones in this article that say "A system of vouchers sounds like a system where there are limits, Chris says. "We can't back down on our promises to our senior citizens." How are they backing down on promises to seniors when everyone who's read the budget proposal already knows that it won't affect seniors? This stuff is not just on CNN Or MSNBC, but coming straight from the campaign itself.

http://www.barackobama.com/news/entr...urce=read-more

Just like this ad, not from an outside source but from the Obama campaign itself
As you'll note, they show old people while saying that the Ryan plan cuts their benefits.... which, of course is a lie. They also are specifically targeting Florida because of the retired population and mentioning AARP, even though we all know that is false. It's up to Ryan and Romney to let everyone who is being swayed by these ads (I mean the average person would see that and say "the president wouldn't lie about this, right?") know that it's factually wrong. The president just wants to promise everything to everyone in an effort to get elected even though he knows the system is heading towards collapse. This guy will say whatever he has to in order to get 4 more years, and regardless of if you're a Democrat or a Republican it's just plain wrong.

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post #23 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 09:58 AM
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^^^^^Awesome post man, so true!

We don't need to pick sides, we just need to know the truth. Let your vote be based on TRUTH.

If you know the truth and decide to vote for someone, whether I agree with it or not I have to respect it. But to vote based on lies isn't right.

And it's not right for the country that they are doing this. I am proud to say that the 'right' isn't dropping to that level, and they better not!


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post #24 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 12:30 PM
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If your looking for truth without the facts and words and policies being twisted, don't go to EITHER campaigns website. They only put the things that you want to see there. If you use either site to pick who you're voting for, you might as well just let CNN or Fox news pick your candidate.
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post #25 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 12:41 PM
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If your looking for truth without the facts and words and policies being twisted, don't go to EITHER campaigns website. They only put the things that you want to see there. If you use either site to pick who you're voting for, you might as well just let CNN or Fox news pick your candidate.
I absolutely agree, UNLESS it's a proposal by the person running for office. Then you need to read the ACTUAL proposal, not something that a 3rd party website publishes.

Much like what you did with regards to Medicare cuts. You used a reference of a 3rd party website, not the bill itself.

I'll ask, did you read the bill? It's not long, only 98 pages. You should read it if you haven't.


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post #26 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 12:46 PM
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Reading an actual bill, especially one that is 98 pages, would do no good to me. I, along with most people, wouldn't understand most of the bill's jargon and referencing. Not saying that 3rd party is the way to go, but for many it's the only way. The only thing we can do is read as much as we can and process the FACTS and come to our own conclusion that way.
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post #27 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 12:49 PM
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Reading an actual bill, especially one that is 98 pages, would do no good to me. I, along with most people, wouldn't understand most of the bill's jargon and referencing. Not saying that 3rd party is the way to go, but for many it's the only way. The only thing we can do is read as much as we can and process the FACTS and come to our own conclusion that way.
So you've never even tried then, otherwise you would know it's not all that difficult to read it.

I find it interesting that you'll believe some 3rd party slant on something you can read for yourself, but refuse to read it yourself.

But you laugh at me? Interesting...


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post #28 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 12:52 PM
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In case you change your mind, here is the original bill (98 pages): Path to Prosperity

Keep in mind that they have actually been listening to what us, the people have been saying. They are trashing this bill for a new revised bill that will incorporate a lot of the concerns that have been raised.

Just imagine what could have been if the administration would have done that with PPACA. Such a shame...


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post #29 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 01:09 PM
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I never said I've never read actual bills. I have. I've also found that the "3rd party" info that I've read about the bills has been fairly accurate. Words are just misconstrued and facts are twisted. Not too hard to see through that and look at the facts.
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post #30 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-16-2012, 01:13 PM
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I never said I've never read actual bills. I have. I've also found that the "3rd party" info that I've read about the bills has been fairly accurate. Words are just misconstrued and facts are twisted. Not too hard to see through that and look at the facts.
Ok, so then why you would say Ryan plans to gut medicare and post a link to some news organization?

When the very purpose of his plan is to SAVE it. If Ryan's plan doesn't get passed, Medicare is GONE in under 12 years, PERIOD.

But you bash him for trying to save it. Makes complete sense...


"at 8k i often get the tire to slip a bit(kinda like stoner in motogp) when i start to get on the throttle"
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