Tyre Warmers with road tyres - 600RR.net
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-10-2016, 10:47 AM Thread Starter
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Tyre Warmers with road tyres

Hi guys, did my first trackday on the new bike yesterday at Knockhill. Absolutely loved it. It took me a while to figure out the correct pressures for the Mezeler's but once I got there I was loving it. I did have some problems with confidence with the front brake because it was spongy (I knew that going into the trackday) but other than that the bike performed incredibly.

My next upgrade is definitely going to be tyre warmers. It was taking my 4 laps (its a short circuit) to start feeling confident in the tyres.

I currently don't have a spare set of wheels, for a set of wets. So I'm currently riding Metzeler Sportec M7RR so I can have confidence in both the dry and wet.

However I have read that you can't use tyre warmers on road tyres. The tyre warmers I have been looking at heat up to 80'C (176F) and can not be controlled. Is this too much for a road tyre?

Thanks in advance
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-10-2016, 12:46 PM
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Cant comment but also intrested. Ive heard of people using warmers with road tires tho160 was around a few temps ive heard of.. why not get a better tire? I run q3's and with in a lap on a 2 mile circuit i feel like there up to temp.

Not that your tires are bad but sounds like your unhappy with the warm up time.

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Last edited by mran556; 04-10-2016 at 12:50 PM.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-10-2016, 01:37 PM Thread Starter
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The reason why I went for those tyres was because I live in Scotland, and wanted something that I could have confidence in in both the dry and wet. I'll hopefully be getting race tyres and wets, but first I need to buy a front wheel.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-10-2016, 06:06 PM
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Tire warmers are fine on road tires, they heat up way more then 160 under the pressure of track riding anyway. I have a set of wheels off a 2013 CBR with Q3’s if you are interested. [email protected]
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-11-2016, 02:35 PM
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When you say first track day on new bike, have you done track days before, just not this bike, or is this your first ever track day? If this was your first ever track day, I would recommend getting some more track experience before spending money on warmers. I've been doing track days for 10+ years and never used or felt like I needed warmers. I know several other riders that have been riding even longer, and are well above my skill that don't use tire warmers for track days. Unless actually racing, warmers are not all that critical.

However, lots of people have them and use them, so don't let me stop you, I just don't think they are necessary.

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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-11-2016, 05:34 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darcshadow View Post
When you say first track day on new bike, have you done track days before, just not this bike, or is this your first ever track day? If this was your first ever track day, I would recommend getting some more track experience before spending money on warmers. I've been doing track days for 10+ years and never used or felt like I needed warmers. I know several other riders that have been riding even longer, and are well above my skill that don't use tire warmers for track days. Unless actually racing, warmers are not all that critical.

However, lots of people have them and use them, so don't let me stop you, I just don't think they are necessary.
I have only done two previous track days before, and this is my first dedicated track bike. I plan on getting as many track days under my belt this year and then hopefully start racing next year. I realise tyre warmers are not a necessity, but for the extra safety and confidence factor they give I think they are worth the money. It took me 3-4 laps before I started to have any confidence in the tyres.

I think I will wait for now, until I get a set of race tyres before purchasing. But they are something I definitely want to have, for the reasons I mentioned.

Thanks for your input though.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-11-2016, 05:58 PM
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3-4 laps seems rather long. I know you said it was a short circuit, how short is it? Shortest track I've been on was 1.3 and the tires usually felt good after a lap, maybe lap and a half. What type of tires you running and what pressure did you have them at?

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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 04:21 AM
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Personally I don't see the need for warmers on the M7RR's. I've run them on a go-cart track (approx. 1 mile long) and I could drag knees after the first lap, so there seem to be nothing wrong with the M7RR's warm-up time. What kind of pressures were you running? I found them best at 30psi (cold) front and rear. The softer carcass seems to need some pressure to support the tyre but also give some squirm from the rear under drive out of corners. Must say I was very impressed with the performance. Seem to be comparable with Pirelli Diablo Rosso Corsa in terms of dry grip, but way better wet grip.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 03:14 PM
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I've always run warmers with street tires at the track. Screw warm up laps lol. Just don't overcook them. If running an ABC group format I'll put them on and run them for the first 10min I'm back in them turn them off but leave them on the tire insulating it. Never had an issue with this method and I also only have one temp [hot] warmers. There is no way you get enough heat into a tire and rim in 1-2 laps.

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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 04:43 PM
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Ive ran m7rr's with and without warmers and fine either way. about 1 lap id say put enough heat in to them. I ran them at oulton park in febuary and were very good.
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bored&stroked View Post
There is no way you get enough heat into a tire and rim in 1-2 laps.
Your probably very accurate. Makes me want some warmers. Uh but then i need a genny

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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 05:47 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darcshadow View Post
3-4 laps seems rather long. I know you said it was a short circuit, how short is it? Shortest track I've been on was 1.3 and the tires usually felt good after a lap, maybe lap and a half. What type of tires you running and what pressure did you have them at?
It was 1.3miles also. I didn't get the tyres correct until the last 2 sessions. I kept dropping them, ended up at 28 rear and 30 front Hot. Maybe it was because it was a new bike, new track and new tyres I was imagining them to be not as grippy as I wanted. Starting the session with them cold (I guess 3-4 PSI down on the hot pressures), with them being road tyres thats a lot under the 36-42 they should be run at. Thats why they could feel so awful and with me taking it steady, it takes them longer to warm up.

When the tyres were warm and I had the correct pressures, they did feel great.
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 06:05 PM
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Your probably very accurate. Makes me want some warmers. Uh but then i need a genny
Here in the desert of California, one lap is good enough (at least for me).
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-12-2016, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RRboi View Post
It was 1.3miles also. I didn't get the tyres correct until the last 2 sessions. I kept dropping them, ended up at 28 rear and 30 front Hot. Maybe it was because it was a new bike, new track and new tyres I was imagining them to be not as grippy as I wanted. Starting the session with them cold (I guess 3-4 PSI down on the hot pressures), with them being road tyres thats a lot under the 36-42 they should be run at. Thats why they could feel so awful and with me taking it steady, it takes them longer to warm up.



When the tyres were warm and I had the correct pressures, they did feel great.

30f/28r hot off the track is very low for road tyres. I don't usually go under 29 cold which would be 33 off warmers.

You were probably finding they took a long time to make up the pressures and feel normal. 30/30 set cold should be fine for all but advanced level at which point you'd be on the wrong tyres. If anything at 30/30 when you get faster you might need to add a PSI or two to stop them overheating.
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-13-2016, 03:01 AM
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So far in the cold weather I've ran mine at 32 hot from the warmers. And when I've come back in they have been around the same. When it's warmer I'll go for 30psi.
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post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-13-2016, 09:22 AM
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I've ran the Pirelli Diablo Rosso Corsas and they have such a soft carcass I start around 33 cold. If I go much lower than than that, they did take more than a lap to feel good.

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post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-13-2016, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darcshadow View Post
I've ran the Pirelli Diablo Rosso Corsas and they have such a soft carcass I start around 33 cold. If I go much lower than than that, they did take more than a lap to feel good.
Less air means the heat up faster.

Heres a good read imo for people looking at tire pressure thats dave moss btw
Running 23 front cold and 21 rear cold on dunlop q3's. 30/30 seems extremely high now.


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post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-13-2016, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by mran556 View Post
Less air means the heat up faster.
True, but they'd have to heat up more for the pressure to build to where they'd feel comfortable. For me, at 33 they'd heat up and hold around 35 to 36 psi. If I lowered the pressure, my hot pressures were still around 35 to 36 meaning they were heating more to achieve the same end goal and judging from tire wear they were too hot and not wearing as they should.

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post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old 04-13-2016, 09:55 PM
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Gotcha . I cant rly judge my self the tire wear that is. Mr moss is a pro ill take his word for it...

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