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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:01 PM Thread Starter
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Question de-tune

Just a newbie question i guess. searched but didn't find.
Is it possible for a beginning rider to retard-tune with something like a power commander (or similar). If something like a tuner can help with power can it also do the opposite?

Just for the beginner to get into somewhat less trouble.
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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:05 PM
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Should have got a 250, genius.

Oh, and you win a short term slot in my signature for such a silly question.

Last edited by Jyn; 04-27-2009 at 11:08 PM.
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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:09 PM
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Haha! No self control??? Don't get hurt!

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...What you do, is give it full throttle, you know, until you are hitting the rev limiter. Then you just let go of the clutch. Guaranteed something spectacular will happen!
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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:10 PM
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Just keep the rpm below 7000 and you should be fine
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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jyn View Post
Should have got a 250, genius.
As harshly as it was put, sadly it's the truth. Barring multiple piston failures, even the most mechanically unhealthy 600RR is way too powerful and unforgiving for beginners.

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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:16 PM
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:19 PM Thread Starter
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asking the question before i buy the 600rr. but thanks for the genius answer

Sorry my question is not up to par for you. guess I'll stick with the search button instead of posting
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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2009, 11:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tietje_3 View Post
asking the question before i buy the 600rr. but thanks for the genius answer

Sorry my question is not up to par for you. guess I'll stick with the search button instead of posting
he's probably just saying that if you have to ask to detune a 600rr you should probably look at getting a lower horsepower bike. just get a learner bike that will give you confidence to ride a higher performance bike. you may be able to learn on a 600rr, but i've heard many a story where it ended up costing the person a lot in fixes and medical bills.

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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 12:04 AM
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Don't worry about what those other guys are saying.

I started out on a 2008 ninja 250r earlier this year, and got several months of very valuable experience on that bike. It's a lot of fun, fast at first, very forgiving, etc. I started to get use to the speed, and wot through 3rd and 4th wasn't a big deal anymore.

Anyway I'm now upgrading to a 2008 600rr, and WOW, it's night and day difference over the 250r. I can't IMAGINE starting out on a 600rr; and I'm a very tame responsible rider. The 600rr is very twitchy on the throttle; I can see how people can get into trouble really fast. I value those months I had on the 250r, and so glad I started out doing this right with the smaller bike. I highly recommend it.

From what I hear the 2009 gsxr's have a "de-tuned" switch, sort of like a beginner mode, then flip up to an advance mode. A lot of people bawk that a sportsbike shouldn't have this. I think it's a good move by suski and they'll sell more bikes (to potential newbies) because of it, imo.

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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 12:08 AM
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If you're serious about limiting the power, it can easily be done. Something can be made to "limit" the throttle so no matter what, you can't go more than like half throttle. Even if you accidentally dump the clutch or something.

Go to a bicycle shop and get a cable clamp off of some bike part ( cheap brake or something) and clamp it to the throttle cable by the throttle bodies. Set it to whatever "max" throttle you want and there you go. Cheaper than buying a 250 then selling it for a 600. And cheaper than a PC.

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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 12:34 AM
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you could try installing a larger sprocket on the front, and a smaller sprocket on the back as well, im not sure if they make 'em. but thats somethingyou could look into. it should decrease your acceleration but increase your top speed.. other than that the throttle stop idea would work too
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tietje_3 View Post
asking the question before i buy the 600rr. but thanks for the genius answer

Sorry my question is not up to par for you. guess I'll stick with the search button instead of posting
its not just the power you have to worry about. Clutch control, braking is more tricky with the 600 than with a 250. If you have not bought a bike yet, stick with the 250.


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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 12:42 AM
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as billy goat said, the gsxr's have a mode switch that is highly effective, i tried my buddies 750 and i could not believe what a big difference it made. definately helping them sell bikes to noobs

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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 02:32 AM
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use ur hands:) if u cant control the throttle u shouldnt be on the thing:) nothing is gonna detune the bike to ninja 250 speeds but use ur hands be slow and smooth and ull be ok.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 08:36 AM
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You may be able to install a bolt or something on the engine side of the throttle cable assembly. Some bikes have a spot for it for power restriction due to licensing or other rules in some countries
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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcope17 View Post
Go to a bicycle shop and get a cable clamp off of some bike part ( cheap brake or something) and clamp it to the throttle cable by the throttle bodies. Set it to whatever "max" throttle you want and there you go. Cheaper than buying a 250 then selling it for a 600. And cheaper than a PC.
This should like a pretty simple and painless idea if i do decide to get the 600rr instead of the ex250. Just trying to cover all angles

What "redlinernyc" mentioned is something i did not think as much about; but he completely accurate in my opinion

Thanks everyone for the useful input
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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-28-2009, 07:59 PM
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Cheaper than buying a 250 then selling it for a 600. And cheaper than a PC.
This is an absolute myth... The fact that Kawi has a $300 rebate at the moment and always sell out of the 250r, I've never heard of anyone loosing money buying one. All my friends have either made money or came out even.

I even I bought an '04 a few years back, my gf crashed it and when I sold it I was only out $200. Even with minor cosmetic damage these things hold their value extremely well.

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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-29-2009, 12:16 AM
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^^ with the gas prices last summer, you couldn't get your hands on a 250. Unless you wanted to pad the previous owners pockets. I'm sure you could make some money. Buy one in the winter when no one is looking for a bike, then sell it in summer when gas is $5 a gallon. You can easily make a few dollars that way.

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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-29-2009, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chipmunkofdoom2 View Post
As harshly as it was put, sadly it's the truth. Barring multiple piston failures, even the most mechanically unhealthy 600RR is way too powerful and unforgiving for beginners.


yea, could even be worse. I've seen some cases of misfires and timing issues where as you give it gas it bogs down and of all sudden... BAM... the bog goes away suddenly, the bike lurches and the rpms shoot sky high because the person was giving it more gas to make up for the bogging....


let me tell you... it'll make for some interesting riding...and by interesting i mean you can die :icon_lol:

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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-12-2009, 05:52 PM
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For a first bike I honestly cannot recommend a supersport (600 or 1000).

I started out on a Kawasaki 650 "Ninja" and rode it for 7,800 miles. I loved the bike. It was a fantastic bike. Stupid reliable, comfortable, well mannered, great gas mileage, and was forgiving enough for a complete noob to drive. It had a pretty satisfactory amount of power too that got fun as I got more experienced.

I traded it in on an 07 CBR600RR and I'm glad I waited to get a supersport. The Ninja was fast but the difference between the two bikes is night and day. The CBR is fast. Stupid fast. The Kawasaki had about 70hp at the wheel, the CBR has closer to 110hp at the rear wheel.

Take the MSF. Go out and buy a "beginner bike". Kawasaki makes 5 EXCELLENT models: the 250r, the 500, ER6n, Verseys, and the 650 ninja. Suzuki's SV650, Gladius, and GSXF650 are awesome as well (though I do prefer the 'standard' SV650, it kind of sounds like a Ducati).

Once you've tooled around for a few months and gained some experience go ahead and dive right in to the supersport crowd. You absolutely will not regret getting a beginner bike. In fact you'll probably sorely miss it when you trade it in on your supersport. I miss mine.....
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post #21 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-15-2009, 01:19 PM
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Unless you use the potential of the bike, which is not a good thing to do on the road, a 600 isn't that much more difficult to ride than a 250. Braking and turning is almost similar. Twisting the trottle to the stop is a different matter, you will reach high speeds very quickly and you can get into trouble before you know it. But, stick to the speedlimits (ish), and you will be fine. My best advice: Go to race school and learn how to use your bike to the fullest under controlled conditions!

With regards to OP: You can tune your engine with a Power Commander or similar to make your bike a little less snatchy when rolling on the throttle. I had a bit of trouble at first with my bike, because it would respond too directly when I started to twist the throttle at the apex in turns. Increasing fuelling about 5% at lower revs and throttle openings (after a tip from someone on this forum) made the bike easier to ride. But it will not take away a lot of power., so you will still have to be careful. You would probably have to drastically change ignition timing as well as fuelling in order to limit power to the same level as a 250 Ninja.

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post #22 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-17-2009, 12:02 PM
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I don't really disagree with you oppoden but my reasons for not recommending a supersport as a first bike are the incredible amounts of power available in the upper RPM range.

Yeah my little 600 is well mannered at 5k and below. Very docile. Between 5 and 7 it gets more exciting, 7-9K gets quite fun and anything north of 9K hold the f&$K on.

It's like Jekel and Hyde.
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