Hard accelleration smoking - 600RR.net
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 02:40 PM Thread Starter
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Hard accelleration smoking

Hello all and thanks for your time!
I have an issue under very hard accelleration, in gear or neutral (just for testing) I don't usually rev my engine in neutral. If i just ride at part throttle going easy from a stop it doesn't smoke at all, If i accell hard, i get a rather large puff of black smoke but it seems to have a tinge of blue. I don't burn a substantial amount of oil because the level isn't really moving much. It seems to have started after i removed the PAIR valve, and didn't the clean air mod. I also changed my oil at the same time as that with the Honda OEM oil and filter. Since then i have changed to full synthetic oil. Some people said it could be the the valve seals. Could it be from removing the Pair valve? or what else could cause this?
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 02:50 PM
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how many miles do you have on the bike?

do a valve check and check the compression.

Some black smoke is normal under hard acceleration. You should see the 08+ 1krr, they are like a smoke machine

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-24-2012, 03:33 PM
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The oil level will fluctuate a little depending on where the oil settles every time you turn off your bike - some times more oil will be in defferent crevases in the engine and not in the pan which causes the level in the sight glass to fluctuate up and down a few mm from time to time.

keep an eye on your oil level and if it isn't consistantly going down, burning oil isn't your problem.

black smoke is usually caused from an engine running rich (un burnt fuel) get your bike dyno'd it should help fix this.

my guess is your bike is just running rich... also if your air filter is clogged or durty it can cause your bike to run rich too

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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-25-2012, 12:46 PM Thread Starter
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I currently have 28k miles on this bike, I was going to adjust the valves at 30k . I replaced the air filter less than 1-2k ago with a BMC race filter. I also removed the pari valve at this time. My concern is although the smoke is mostly black it seems to have tinge of blue and it worries me. I think my next step is to get the compression test, I was thinking about getting a power commander and seeing if a tune would lean it out to stop some of the black. But i can't think of what has changed that it would now be running so lean!
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 05:16 PM
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Blue isn't fuel, it's oil. The compression check will tell you a lot, checking a spark plug will tell you a lot too. Valve stem seals won't give you bad compression numbers but will make your bike smoke. Usually notably on startup though... What oil are you running?

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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EP3hatch03 View Post
You should see the 08+ 1krr, they are like a smoke machine
That's because they have defective oil control rings and burn more oil than fuel.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 05:32 PM
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That's because they have defective oil control rings and burn more oil than fuel.
I thought in the end this came down to clutch material from the other recall knackering the rings since not everyone had the problem? I think you used to have one, did you have the recall done? I've always liked them but have passed for obvious reasons.

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 03:20 AM
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What other mods do you have besides the BMC race filter and PAIR mod? That PAIR mod will probably alter the o2 sensors readings ultimately affecting a/f ratios aswell, since there is no longer additional oxygen being introduced into the exhaust stream. Tuning will most likely be needed if you continue to run the PAIR delete. Since there is fresh GN4 or HP4 in there, monitor the color and level. The color should change gradually over a 1k interval but not clear to dark 300 miles interval(indicates wearing/worn piston rings). Check the spark plugs for oil followed by a comp. test if possible. Good luck....
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 07:05 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the help everyone, i will take the tank off very soon to check the plugs and see if its oily in the plug stems. I will also look into getting a power commander to get the bike tuned properly Ill update this if i figure anything out. Really hope its not the piston rings :c
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-30-2012, 03:14 AM
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Originally Posted by snizzletoff View Post
Thanks for all the help everyone, i will take the tank off very soon to check the plugs and see if its oily in the plug stems. I will also look into getting a power commander to get the bike tuned properly Ill update this if i figure anything out. Really hope its not the piston rings :c
Sounds like it's running rich... Oil is usually a white cloud. Turbo cars run rich to keep things cool and they will let off black clouds under hard acceleration. Oil also lets off a certain smell. Does this cloud smell like gas or like a horrible clutch burning smell? Especially if you run a straight exhaust pipe with just a muffler. I would look into the tuning first or maybe even a faulty injector thats dumping to much gas.

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Last edited by Roadspike; 05-30-2012 at 03:18 AM.
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-30-2012, 01:32 PM Thread Starter
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I have a turbo'ed car i understand what you mean about the cloud of black. This is sorta like that in the fact that when i accelerate hard i get the puff of smoke. And tuning or an injector may fix this but it still smells oily and i can see a bit of blue in the smoke. I had a buddy ride behind me and he said he constantly smelled oil even when the bike wasn't smoking. So I can certainly assume im always burning a bit or its in the exhaust. If i get time i want to pull the plugs tonight, if they are black im guessing its the rings. With further research that's what its looking like it might be. Now i need to debate if its worth trying to fix it or move on to another bike :c

I have rebuilt car engines, but this seems a good bit different. Dose the transmission need to be removed / split from the block to gain access to the Connecting rod caps?
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-30-2012, 01:35 PM Thread Starter
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Just looked up a thread on replacing the oil pan, no one says anything about removing the tranny so id assume id be good to just drop the pan and get to the caps that way. I know it should be done if the bearings are worn, but if the cam and crank bearings look good should i bother replacing them or just do the rings, Head gasket, all other gaskets needed? May also do the valve seals while its all apart
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-31-2012, 03:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snizzletoff View Post
Just looked up a thread on replacing the oil pan, no one says anything about removing the tranny so id assume id be good to just drop the pan and get to the caps that way. I know it should be done if the bearings are worn, but if the cam and crank bearings look good should i bother replacing them or just do the rings, Head gasket, all other gaskets needed? May also do the valve seals while its all apart
hopefully not the rings though.. Ohh that would totally suck! Is your oil level going down a lot? Like are you adding a quart every couple weeks? You should have some mad oil consumption if its that bad.

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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-31-2012, 06:51 AM Thread Starter
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I actually just rebuild an engine on a minivan with bad rings, They were going through almost 5 quarts of oil in a week or 2, I was down .5 quarts after 2k miles...nothing outrages. I really don't want it to be the rings. But maybe one ring has a small crack or something. I want to know what it is, but i'm unsure of a way to figure it out without just tearing it apart.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-31-2012, 10:19 PM
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You can just pull the exhaust and if it's valve stem seals you can usually see it coming down the valve.

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