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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 07:56 PM Thread Starter
 
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To Nemesis....

I know you wouldn't believe anyone here when they said Pedrosa has a serious weight advantage.

Did you listen to Freddie Spencer during the race? He pointed out how much of an advantage Pedrosa's weight is. He gets better drives out of the corners because he has less mass to move. A 50# advantage on a 350lb motorcycle makes a big difference.

Say what you want, we all know Pedrosa has talent but to insist his weight isn't a big advantage is absolutely ignorning facts. If Freddie (and other racers) say it's true, and they have credibility, I believe it.
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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 08:40 PM
 
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If it is a big advantage as everyone claims it to be, why is it out of the 11 races so far this year he has only recorded the top speed trap four times?

If it is such an advantage why is he not beating EVERYONE down the straights?

If it is such an advantage how does he not outbrake everyone?

He's fast because he has talent.

On the 250's and 125's it played a bigger advantage. Now he is on a big boy bike, with twice the horse power and 100+ pounds more of bike.

I'm sure him being 50 lbs less than his competitors gives him a small advantage, but nothing near the amount that everyone is making out to be, and certainly not a big one. He's on a race bike, not a race horse.
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 08:55 PM
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He has a weight advantage but being 5'2" and 103lbs can also be a disadvantage. He can't muscle the bike around like other riders.

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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 09:19 PM
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+1 to that! Weight is a big deal when racing motorcycles.

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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 09:23 PM
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Like big Tuna says, it has advantages and disadvantages. I'm glad the disadvantages came into play today. I got my money on him next for the championship.

This year I'm chearing for Hayden.

"For me, the problem is that big part of MotoGP riders now are pussies,"Rossi declared. "In the past, this is normal, the riders were more like real men. Now it is more like they are children."

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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-23-2006, 09:30 PM
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If it wasn't for traction control,I think his 103lb body would hurt him and he wouldn't be able to get the same drive out of the corner.

Why do the vendors want us to buy there stuff when they never have it in stock?
:book1: One thing leads to another and the next thing you know,your bike is a piece of neglected junk. :book1:
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 03:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alaska cajun
If it wasn't for traction control,I think his 103lb body would hurt him and he wouldn't be able to get the same drive out of the corner.
I agree. Especially in the wet.
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 09:55 AM
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did you guys see when Freddie Spencer was interviewing Dani??? dang... Freddie looked like a freaking giant next to Dani --- and on the side note - i actually saw Dani crack a smile --- this kid got talent and for sure he's gonna win a championship (most likely next year)
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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfpac52
If it is a big advantage as everyone claims it to be, why is it out of the 11 races so far this year he has only recorded the top speed trap four times?

If it is such an advantage why is he not beating EVERYONE down the straights?

If it is such an advantage how does he not outbrake everyone?

He's fast because he has talent.

On the 250's and 125's it played a bigger advantage. Now he is on a big boy bike, with twice the horse power and 100+ pounds more of bike.

I'm sure him being 50 lbs less than his competitors gives him a small advantage, but nothing near the amount that everyone is making out to be, and certainly not a big one. He's on a race bike, not a race horse.
Ask Freddie Spencer. I mean, what does he know about racing?

If Freddie says Dani's weight is a huge advantage, I'm inclined to believe him.
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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 01:21 PM
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Because of Danny ;) next year they are going to ballast the 800cc GP bikes like they do in 250cc and F1. The bike + rider weight will be the same for everyone. He may not win next years championship because of this.
post #11 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motorcycle Daily
The next king of MotoGP will come down to two riders; Dani Pedrosa or Casey Stoner. These two rookies will be the ones to watch as they have already proved after only one race. This is unfortunate for me because I'd like to see Nicky or John on top next.
Dani Pedrosa already a 3 time champion is with the best team riding for the most powerful factory has so much going for him. He is Spanish and has three home races every year which I believe has to be an advantage. He is very small (5'02" 105lbs.). His size gives him a 30 to 50lb. weight advantage over many other riders that reduces tire wear and should make any bike a fraction of a second faster. Pedrosa's style is so precise he rarely makes mistakes and that's key to staying up front and out of the kitty litter. I believe others even Rossi will have trouble defeating him in the near future.

by: Alex Edge
i was able to find this info from the website, stating information being spoken about here. i do see it as an advantage. In all honesty, with out the years of experience and skill... the 50lbs diffrence doesnt matter. Rossi can easily dust him, in a less HP motorcyle and with the extra weight he carries.

in conclusion.... the 50lbs does not make a diffrence in which will make Pedrosa have as mentioned "A HUGE" advantage.

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post #12 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 01:39 PM
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Actually, there's a good write-up on Dani Pedrosa, regarding his weight ADVANTAGE. Sure, there are disadvantages, for example, not being able to put much weight on the front to keep the bike from wheeling during acceleration. As you may know (or not know), the GP bikes can even wheelie in 4th/5th gear. So, there might be some disadvantage there. His ability to ride in wet conditions and being able to control the bike in the wet.

And yet weight or no weight, we can't discount skill. Dani has great cornering ability, particularly from his 250 experience. He has excellent corner entry skills as well as corner exit. He's smooth and precise. And as we all know, at the GP level, muscling the bike is counterproductive; instead, on a GP bike, the emphasis is on being smooth, which is what Pedrosa is (and incidentally, what Hayden is learning too; you can't muscle the bike like on Superbike, or like Hayden learned on dirt); this isn't the 500 bikes of yore but bikes ladened with electronic gadgetry, including different maps at the press of a button for more speed.

But the write up on Pedrosa said this concerning his weight advantage: Making up time lost in the corners. If I recall correctly, let's say Pedrosa is following a rider into a corner. The first rider hits the corner at 50 mph and exits out. Due to Pedrosa's weight, even if he hits that corner entry at less speed (48/49 mph), due to his weight, he can get on the gas earlier and exit faster at WOT than the rider in front of him, making up time, sometimes up to 0.5 second in a corner.

That 0.5 second advantage over the course of an entire track adds up. Now, this is if he's perfect in every corner which no one is, not even the great Rossi. But, you can't argue that 0.5 seconds in a corner is not a huge advantage. What did Ewen McGregor say in DTK if you were 1 second back every lap for 32 laps?

And for the record, it was Dani's first win in China where he set blistering lap times, which incidentally has the longest straight of the tracks raced so far (1200 meters).

Donnington happens to be one of Dani's favorite tracks which allows him to really exploit his cornering prowess and demonstrates what I said above. 0.5 seconds over every corner over the entire race... How much time was between him and second place? It was like he was racing alone out there for the longest time until Rossi really made up the gap; Dani ended up winning by almost 4 seconds.

Let's not even get on tire discussion. He set his fastest lap on lap 19 of 22 in China.

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post #13 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 01:43 PM
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+1.... exactly along the lines as what BigTuna had mentioned as well.

great post sooperman12!

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post #14 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 02:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Ask Freddie Spencer. I mean, what does he know about racing?

If Freddie says Dani's weight is a huge advantage, I'm inclined to believe him.
This is the same guy that kept calling him Petrosa and the series Motor GP :)

If his weight is such an advantage I have yet to see him use it. Top four speed traps out of 11 doesn't show me an advantage.

As far as China goes, the top speed holder for that track is actually Tamada, the guy on a non factory Honda, 2.6 KM/h faster than the midget.

Races are not won down the front straight. They are won on the brakes and corner speed. If his advantage was so paramount that everyone claims it to be, he would be walking away with the championship. Out braking everyone into the corners and walking away through the corners.

Why is it so hard for people to accept that his talent severley out weighs his mass? If he grew 6 inches (making him 5'1" tall) and gained 50 pounds (105 lbs) I garuntee that his lap times would not suffer a single bit.
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post #15 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 03:38 PM
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So, I fail to see why people are accusing SilverSurfer for having said "less weight equals more top speed". If I recall, and it doesn't take that much (just scroll up), it was you Wolfpac who equated less weight with top speed. As we all know, weight has negligble effect on top speed at the peak of an engine's performance.

Case in point is the review on the Kawisaki ZX-14R, whose top speed ended up being a disappointing, though 'Busa upsetting, 186.5 mph. No matter how much more aerodynamic the body plastics got, it was said to see any real improvements in top speed, the bike would have to make somewhere on the order of 240 hp (or 65 hp more on top of its 175 hp) to get just another 10 or so mphs of top speed.

That being said, the argument SS made was that Spencer said Pedrosa's weight advantage helps him, NOT in top speed down a straight, but drive out of a corner, which I spoke about in the post before this. And this is in fact a considerable advantage.

Is it race winning advantage? Maybe, maybe not. You're talking about being perfect corner after corner and accumulating that 0.5 sec advantage over EACH corner. Can it happen? Yes, look at Donnington, a twisty, tight track that Pedrosa happens to love. Precise at every turn. I think his lead at one point was up to TEN SECONDS!!! Props to Rossi for cutting that lead down to just about 4 seconds.

So, there is skill involved. But buddy, weight is equally a factor. And I tell you that difference in weight is probably what contributed to his win in China, for the very reason I mentioned in my last post. Hayden was fast in China, but Pedrosa was faster in the turns, not necessarily because of technique, if you watch the tape. Both were precise, but Dani just got out of those turns that much faster. And THAT, my friend, is the advantage -- big or small. It's still an advantage.

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post #16 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 04:00 PM
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Didn't we already cover this in my original thread? So, why the need to create another and direct the thread to me?

Another thing, did you see Dani smile during that interview? You probably won't meet a racer as modest as this guy. He doesn't gloat (sp?), complain, nor act like he's the ish. Did you know he raced in the 250cc class last year with a fractured wrist throughout the whole season without telling a single soul? And he still won the championship. He kept it all to himself. Never complained about the pain, never said anything.

And on top of that, he places podium in Laguna (first time there)?!!! 2 MotoGP wins in his rookie year. And how many times did he place podium this year IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR?? And how many times did Nicky Hayden win or place podium during HIS rookie year???

Yes, thank you.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemesis
Didn't we already cover this in my original thread? So, why the need to create another and direct the thread to me?

Another thing, did you see Dani smile during that interview? You probably won't meet a racer as modest as this guy. He doesn't gloat (sp?), complain, nor act like he's the ish. Did you know he raced in the 250cc class last year with a fractured wrist throughout the whole season without telling a single soul? And he still won the championship. He kept it all to himself. Never complained about the pain, never said anything.

And on top of that, he places podium in Laguna (first time there)?!!! 2 MotoGP wins in his rookie year. And how many times did he place podium this year IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR?? And how many times did Nicky Hayden win or place podium during HIS rookie year???

Yes, thank you.
Nicky didn't have the advantage of knowing the tracks like Pedrosa did. Pedrosa had three years to learn the tracks before he came to MotoGP. Nicky came straight from the AMA. They have the same amount of time on those tracks (both in their 4th year). Nicky has 2 wins, Pedrosa has 2 wins. Pretty even if you ask me.

I noticed you did not answer the question. If Freddie says Pedrosa's weight matters a lot, would you say Freddie doesn't know what he's talking about?

Just curious, amigo...
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post #18 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Nicky didn't have the advantage of knowing the tracks like Pedrosa did. Pedrosa had three years to learn the tracks before he came to MotoGP. Nicky came straight from the AMA. They have the same amount of time on those tracks (both in their 4th year).
Stop contradicting yourself!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Nicky has 2 wins, Pedrosa has 2 wins. Pretty even if you ask me.
Even?...hahaaa

A veteran vs rookie yet they have the same number of wins. Yeah, it's even alright....hahaa

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
I noticed you did not answer the question. If Freddie says Pedrosa's weight matters a lot, would you say Freddie doesn't know what he's talking about?

Just curious, amigo...

So, if Dani said it was hard for him to adapt to the bike would you say Dani doesn't know what he's talking about?

Just curious, amigo (amigo my @$$)
post #19 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by ~BLACK ICE~
+1.... exactly along the lines as what BigTuna had mentioned as well.

great post sooperman12!
yeah, but I hate typing so I left it short and sweet

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post #20 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 06:50 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemesis
Stop contradicting yourself!

Even?...hahaaa

A veteran vs rookie yet they have the same number of wins. Yeah, it's even alright....hahaa
They have the same amount of time on the European tracks. If you know the GP bikes, you'll notice the 250 racers have an advantage because the GP bikes can be ridden more like a 250 using the same lines due to the technology "traction control, etc."

If this was 2000 and they were still running 500cc bikes, then I would agree Pedrosa would be at a disadvantage. Those bikes were mean, nasty and powerful and lacked the kind of traction control and smooth power delivery of the GP bikes.


Quote:
So, if Dani said it was hard for him to adapt to the bike would you say Dani doesn't know what he's talking about?

Just curious, amigo (amigo my @$$)
I tend to give more credit to Freddie Spencers opinion - of which you still have not acknowledged ;)
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post #21 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 07:08 PM
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It's true that 250cc racers have advantages over former WSB and/or AMA racers because they have already been riding the same tracks for years. Pedrosa knows all of the tracks in his rookie year, whereas Hayden didn't know ANY of them.

The thing that really makes me believe that Pedrosa is better than Hayden is because of his performances at Shanghai and Laguna this year.

I believe it was Pedrosa's first time racing in China and his first at Laguna. And what did he place? 1st in China and 2nd in USA.

That is unbelievable for a 1st year Moto GP rider. I'd like to know where Nicky placed his first year in China. Pedrosa is simply amazing.

And the whole 50 lb thing is totally over-exaggerated if you ask me. Freddie Spencer may know what he's talking about, but he may be looking at the weight issue through 500cc GP eyes.

A 50 lb advantage might've "weighed" more back in the 500cc days where the bikes were already super light and they had barely any technology. A 250 lb bike losing another 50 lbs from a light rider would've made a HUGE difference on those violent bikes; especially for tire wear.

Now in the 4 stroke era, the bikes are a bit heavier but they have all that technology in them. The suspension is so crazy nowadays that 50 lbs won't do that much good to the tires or whatnot.

Another small rider is Shinya. He is around 120 lbs, I believe. I don't see his weight placing him on podiums. The fact that he's on a crappy bike doesn't help either.

But the point is that Dani winning a lot is simply about him having skills. Not because he is 50 lbs lighter than other riders. Colin weighs like 160 or so and he was kicking ass-in assen. Too bad he skid out on the turf.


Isn't Dani like 20 pts behind Nicky right now? I'd say Nicky better watch out or he's gonna end up getting 2nd place this year.

Dani has a very good chance of taking the title and shocking the world.
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post #22 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
They have the same amount of time on the European tracks. If you know the GP bikes, you'll notice the 250 racers have an advantage because the GP bikes can be ridden more like a 250 using the same lines due to the technology "traction control, etc."
^ to that I say, first you say
Quote:
Nicky didn't have the advantage of knowing the tracks like Pedrosa did.
then you say,
Quote:
They have the same amount of time on the European tracks.
Again, stop contradicting yourself!

What I heard and read of the GP bikes (not like YOU or I know), is that it is more stable and more flickable then the 250cc bikes. So, with Nicky having 3 years with the Motogp bikes that puts HIM at an advantage, not Dani. You gotta remember, Dani has to muscle the bike (to an extent).

It's not that
Quote:
the GP bikes can be ridden more like a 250
but that riders like Dani, Stoner, Marco, Checa, Rossi, Cap, Nakano, etc. can take 250 lines with the GP bikes. And it's not like Nicky can't take the same lines.

Finally, if you need an answer to your original question please refer to my original thread instead of being stupid enough to create a thread directed at me cuzing you're wasting time with me.
post #23 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-24-2006, 10:04 PM
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I wanna chime in, I wanna chime in!

Ok... So... I read this write-up on MotoGP bikes where Rossi, himself said, that if Pedrosa and Stoner came into GP on 500s, there's no way they'd be doing what they are doing now. Okay, FACT, we agree on that. It further says that these riders have an advantage in GP over Superbike/other routes because riding a GP bike is much like riding a 250.

You're probably thinking, "Whoa, whoa, whoa... what?!?!"

Hold on. Here's why they are similar: In 250, to win in the class you gotta be smooth. The emphasis (and critical component to racing) is corner entry (both speed and line) AS WELL AS being smooth. With the current crop of GP bikes, due to electronic gadgetry like traction control, riders have found that the EXACT TYPE OF STYLE is required in GP racing.

"What does that mean?" You ask.

Colin Edwards has been quoted to say that, "It's even harder to race my R1 than it is to race these GP bikes." What's the difference? The thing with GP bikes is you aren't supposed to muscle them like the 500cc, two strokers of yore. Muscling a GP bike won't reward you; it'll make it even more sloppy in the corners.

Now, you're asking, "Soops, what does this have to do with anything?"

Well, if your training ground is anything other than 125, 250 then GP, say WSB, or AMA, then you'll have to re-learn how you race a bike. For Hayden, dirt-tracking and Superbike, muscling the bike helped him be AMA champ. He said, "Being on a GP bike was like being on a bike my first year."

So?

So, this is why Pedrosa, Stoner and the likes all have advantages coming up through 250. If you can pilot the GP bike understanding the riding principles and have trained as such over the course of many years, of COURSE, you'll be poised to make some noise in GP. Of course, you want to couple that with skill and discernment. Something I believe Stoner lacks a bit of right now. (I think he's pushing too much, being too aggressive and not smooth, which is why he's crashing out so much; it's working against him instead of for him).

Hayden has been learning this over the last four years and is now coming into his own. I believe this is what Silver Surfer means. In that way, Pedrosa and Hayden are sort of contemporaries when it comes to time on the bike. Unfortunately, Hayden also has to contend with learning tracks, whereas Pedrosa grew up on these tracks in 125 and 250.

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post #24 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 12:31 AM
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I sorry people but when you have a 250 horse power motorcycle, The size of the rider doesn't make a difference. That is unless its a great denomation like a 100+ lbs. now if you talking about 600cc then yes the lighter riders are going to have an advantage.
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post #25 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 01:52 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemesis
^ to that I say, first you say then you say,

Again, stop contradicting yourself!
Let me clarify.

When Nicky was a rookie, he did NOT know those tracks.
Yes, Pedrosa is a rookie but he has spent the same amount of time on the Euopean circuits as Nicky has.

In other words, they BOTH have the same amount of time on the tracks now. If Pedrosa had not had any experience with the European tracks it is doubtful he would be doing as well.

Quote:
What I heard and read of the GP bikes (not like YOU or I know), is that it is more stable and more flickable then the 250cc bikes. So, with Nicky having 3 years with the Motogp bikes that puts HIM at an advantage, not Dani. You gotta remember, Dani has to muscle the bike (to an extent).
There's no way a MotoGP bike is more flickable than a 250cc bike. I don't buy it.

Quote:
It's not that but that riders like Dani, Stoner, Marco, Checa, Rossi, Cap, Nakano, etc. can take 250 lines with the GP bikes. And it's not like Nicky can't take the same lines.
Nicky never rode a 250cc bike on the European circuits which require different lines.

Quote:
Finally, if you need an answer to your original question please refer to my original thread instead of being stupid enough to create a thread directed at me cuzing you're wasting time with me.
I'm asking you a question in regards to what Freddie Spencer said. Why can't you answer it instead of lobbing insults? I didn't insult you, I asked you a fair question.
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post #26 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 01:55 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12
I wanna chime in, I wanna chime in!

Ok... So... I read this write-up on MotoGP bikes where Rossi, himself said, that if Pedrosa and Stoner came into GP on 500s, there's no way they'd be doing what they are doing now. Okay, FACT, we agree on that. It further says that these riders have an advantage in GP over Superbike/other routes because riding a GP bike is much like riding a 250.

You're probably thinking, "Whoa, whoa, whoa... what?!?!"

Hold on. Here's why they are similar: In 250, to win in the class you gotta be smooth. The emphasis (and critical component to racing) is corner entry (both speed and line) AS WELL AS being smooth. With the current crop of GP bikes, due to electronic gadgetry like traction control, riders have found that the EXACT TYPE OF STYLE is required in GP racing.

"What does that mean?" You ask.

Colin Edwards has been quoted to say that, "It's even harder to race my R1 than it is to race these GP bikes." What's the difference? The thing with GP bikes is you aren't supposed to muscle them like the 500cc, two strokers of yore. Muscling a GP bike won't reward you; it'll make it even more sloppy in the corners.

Now, you're asking, "Soops, what does this have to do with anything?"

Well, if your training ground is anything other than 125, 250 then GP, say WSB, or AMA, then you'll have to re-learn how you race a bike. For Hayden, dirt-tracking and Superbike, muscling the bike helped him be AMA champ. He said, "Being on a GP bike was like being on a bike my first year."

So?

So, this is why Pedrosa, Stoner and the likes all have advantages coming up through 250. If you can pilot the GP bike understanding the riding principles and have trained as such over the course of many years, of COURSE, you'll be poised to make some noise in GP. Of course, you want to couple that with skill and discernment. Something I believe Stoner lacks a bit of right now. (I think he's pushing too much, being too aggressive and not smooth, which is why he's crashing out so much; it's working against him instead of for him).

Hayden has been learning this over the last four years and is now coming into his own. I believe this is what Silver Surfer means. In that way, Pedrosa and Hayden are sort of contemporaries when it comes to time on the bike. Unfortunately, Hayden also has to contend with learning tracks, whereas Pedrosa grew up on these tracks in 125 and 250.
Soop, WELL SAID and yes, exactly what I mean. You have to be smooth on a GP bike to go fast. Just watch them ride. It's very similar to a 250.

250 + smooth = fast, not muscling the bike.
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post #27 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 01:56 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zus600rr#388
I sorry people but when you have a 250 horse power motorcycle, The size of the rider doesn't make a difference. That is unless its a great denomation like a 100+ lbs. now if you talking about 600cc then yes the lighter riders are going to have an advantage.

Freddie Spencer says it matters a lot because lighter weight = better drive out of the corners.

Is Freddie wrong?
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post #28 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 02:20 AM
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not enough weigh means= rear getting loose and spinning up.

is freddy wrong...imo yes

If riders weight made such a difference you would notice it when they hit top speeds. Every rider out there is within a 4 mph range of each other. If you ask me that just comes down to your drive out of the hole!
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post #29 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Let me clarify.

When Nicky was a rookie, he did NOT know those tracks.
Yes, Pedrosa is a rookie but he has spent the same amount of time on the Euopean circuits as Nicky has.

In other words, they BOTH have the same amount of time on the tracks now. If Pedrosa had not had any experience with the European tracks it is doubtful he would be doing as well.
I'm sorry but that still sounds like a contradiction. It must be me because it sounds like you're saying Pedrosa "...spent the same amount of time on the European circuits as Nicky has" and if that's the case then how could this be ----> "If Pedrosa had not had any experience with the European tracks it is doubtful he would be doing as well" if both Nicky and Pedrosa had the same amount of time spent on those tracks?

When Nicky was a rookie so was Pedrosa! However, Nicky had 3 years of experience on a MotoGP bike. Plenty of time to adapt to the bike, the way it handles, and time on the track. So, that gives him an advantage. End of story!


Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
There's no way a MotoGP bike is more flickable than a 250cc bike. I don't buy it.
You won't buy it because you're stubborn. But don't take my word for it because afterall I'm just a nobody. So, here's some validation for you - It was one of the guest commentators who was a good friend of Casey Stoner's and it was Casey who said it was more flickable.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Nicky never rode a 250cc bike on the European circuits which require different lines.
REQUIRE different lines???......hahaha So, if different machines REQUIRE different lines how are Rossi, Marco, Dani, Stoner, etc. able to take 250cc lines on their Mot0GP bikes?

Nicky's a professional rider and surely is smart enough (or not) to pick up on those lines after following other riders who've come from a 250cc background.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
Freddie Spencer says it matters a lot because lighter weight = better drive out of the corners.

Is Freddie wrong?
And when was the last time Freddie rode and raced a MotoGP bike lately? These bikes are different then the ones he's raced on.

Man, it sounds like you're reaching real deep to find excuses as to why others have it better than Nicky.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer
I'm asking you a question in regards to what Freddie Spencer said. Why can't you answer it instead of lobbing insults? I didn't insult you, I asked you a fair question.
Look man, I know what you're trying to do and I don't play this game. You want to ask me a question then do it with the utmost sincerity! Yeah, I know what you're trying to do.

Last edited by Nemesis; 07-25-2006 at 05:59 AM.
post #30 of 34 (permalink) Old 07-25-2006, 08:38 AM
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You have to remember that these bikes don't spin up tires like they used to because of traction control and what not. So, TC allows a bike to grip where they hadn't gripped before. The electronics on the GP bikes really give GP bikes a tamer quality (if there's such thing as taming a 990cc, 260hp beast). And in reality, these GP bikes can be and are ridden much like their 250cc counterparts. Realize that the bikes in the 2006 season are even more controlled than 2005. It was Laguna Seca last year where riders were still developing and learning launch control.

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- Nicky Hayden #69

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