2007 Nicky Hayden Interview - 600RR.net
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-14-2007, 02:36 AM
Nemesis
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
2007 Nicky Hayden Interview

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNy5R8wM_KM
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-14-2007, 06:13 PM
Knee Dragger
 
EricK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Madison,WI
Posts: 162
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
I dont know why there is so many haters towards him.Guy can ride period & just needs better equipment.

K7 GSX-R 600 Blue/White,Racefit Growler,BMC Race,FuelMoto PCIII,HID,BRG 1/5 throttle & Gixxer store FE
EricK is offline  
post #3 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-15-2007, 12:49 AM
Knee Dragger
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: scottsdale/tempe
Posts: 172
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
It's a shame that his season hasn't been a great one. the kid has talent and hopefully next season will be much better for him. All we can do is see what happens.

Some people say that cucumbers taste better pickeled. Huh.... What....

Last edited by A1it'sgood; 10-15-2007 at 12:57 AM.
A1it'sgood is offline  
 
post #4 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-15-2007, 12:54 AM
gee
Overpaid South Pacific Barista overactive ADHD crew off their meds!!
 
gee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: a day ahead
Posts: 27,367
Thanks: 190
Thanked 43 Times in 41 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricK View Post
I dont know why there is so many haters towards him.Guy can ride period & just needs better equipment.
hell yeah he can sure ride... all top ten finishers there can!!
gee is offline  
post #5 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-17-2007, 01:11 PM
Pocketbike Racer
 
Sacrilicious's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 420
Images: 1
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
It's a shame what happened to him this year. Pedrosa seems to be getting all the goodies, and he's left struggling with a number of things.

At least he got one championship while Repsol was still 100% behind him.

03 RR
Sacrilicious is offline  
post #6 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-17-2007, 09:35 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: dirrty south
Posts: 610
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
At least he got one championship while Repsol was still 100% behind him.
+1. Or kind've behind him anyway. after the clutch issues last year, and HRC's famous engineering department saying "we can't fix it," i wondered exactly how far behind him he was. What'd he have, like 6 or 7 different frames?

when he first came in i didn't like him. but he's won me over. go nicky. phillip island would've been a great finish for him too *sigh* i'll turn into a full blown nicky fan the moment he leaves HRC. for anyone.
skittzo is offline  
post #7 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-17-2007, 10:09 PM
Knee Dragger
 
svldvc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 174
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
yeah...but i wish Honda's were a bit faster than what they are...Give 600RR the Gixxer power or Kawi 636R and it will be nice....! :)
svldvc is offline  
post #8 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-17-2007, 11:21 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 591
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacrilicious View Post
It's a shame what happened to him this year. Pedrosa seems to be getting all the goodies, and he's left struggling with a number of things.

At least he got one championship while Repsol was still 100% behind him.
I think the bike was clearly designed with a smaller rider in mind but Nicky has gotten all of the updates thus far, which is why his results have been a lot better in the latter half of the season. Even in Catalunya when you saw Dani run really strong for the first time this season because of a revised chassis, Nicky had that chassis available to him too, he just opted not to use it until he could test it.

Another big breakthrough for Nicky was tuning the traction control down for his riding style and all of a sudden he's gotten some podiums and a pole position.

I'm actually kind of surprised Honda hasn't brought out a pneumatic valved or even desmo engine yet but they're certainly testing at least one of those solutions right now. I'm hoping that they'll bring it out before the end of the season.

Quote:
+1. Or kind've behind him anyway. after the clutch issues last year, and HRC's famous engineering department saying "we can't fix it," i wondered exactly how far behind him he was. What'd he have, like 6 or 7 different frames?
Well for one, if HRC had all of the answers for every engineering problem they wouldn't lose a single race. Once a problem is identified sometimes its not easy to come up with a solution, and sometimes producing a one-off part or series or parts out of exotic metals is time-consuming.

In the case of the clutch the big mistake at HRC was that their test rider was too hesitant to criticize the bike and he didn't help them identify the clutch problem. Honda in their stubborness, rather than listening to Nicky, they listened to their test rider until it was almost too late.
G.Irish is offline  
post #9 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 02:58 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
BoredTiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 895
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I think Nicky is a great rider. I just don't think he's championship material...YET.

He hasn't shown it. The season he won, to me, wasn't convincing or deserved.

I respect Nicky tremendously, and I really like his demeanor and how he looks at racing. I really respect this guy. A true professional. I don't doubt that he will be a great in MotoGP (after a few more championships). I just haven't seen CHAMPIONSHIP from him yet...that's all.

2007 CBR600RR Black/Silver
BoredTiger is offline  
post #10 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 06:48 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: dirrty south
Posts: 610
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Quote:
Well for one, if HRC had all of the answers for every engineering problem they wouldn't lose a single race. Once a problem is identified sometimes its not easy to come up with a solution, and sometimes producing a one-off part or series or parts out of exotic metals is time-consuming.

In the case of the clutch the big mistake at HRC was that their test rider was too hesitant to criticize the bike and he didn't help them identify the clutch problem. Honda in their stubborness, rather than listening to Nicky, they listened to their test rider until it was almost too late.
The famed HRC engineering dept? C'mon. They could've done better. They could've just used the year old clutch off of pedrosa's bike instead of using Nicky's as a testing bed for the 800s. I'm an engineer. and we can't fix it isn't an acceptable answer at any level, much less in MotoGP. They should've got the job done or replaced the clutch. you said it yourself, HRC is too damn stubborn and arrogant. And they like thier spanish oil money.

Besides the engineering dept won't actually build anything. They'll wirte specs and blueprints then farm out the actual manufacturing or construction to another vendor or internal manufacturing. thats what i do. and they can push those guys to the limit. if HRC told x company we need it tomorrow, do you really think they'd say no?
skittzo is offline  
post #11 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 07:42 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 591
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by skittzo View Post
The famed HRC engineering dept? C'mon. They could've done better. They could've just used the year old clutch off of pedrosa's bike instead of using Nicky's as a testing bed for the 800s. I'm an engineer. and we can't fix it isn't an acceptable answer at any level, much less in MotoGP.
Well if you're an engineer you know that solving a problem in a domain where you're writing the book as your going along is not always easy or expedient. In Moto GP and Formula 1 the answers are not always there, that's why the manufacturers compete there. Furthermore they were having a personnel problem. As an engineer you should also know that when trying to isolate a problem it must be repeatable. They weren't getting it with their test rider so that's why it went on for longer than it should have. They eventually took that guy out of that role (or so they said).

Quote:
They should've got the job done or replaced the clutch. you said it yourself, HRC is too damn stubborn and arrogant. And they like thier spanish oil money.
It was not the case of "oh we've got this clutch sitting on the shelf" or "we'll just call up this supplier, they've got it sitting on the shelf". And don't even bring up that Repsol conspiracy theory nonsense. The money Repsol gives Honda is a drop in the bucket compared to what Honda spends in total for Moto GP. Honda sent Camel and Telefonica Movistar packing because they were making demands that conflicted with their interests, they surely don't give a damn if they have to do the same with Repsol. As a matter of fact, that's why HRC signed Dani directly rather than letting him sign a contract with Repsol. To prevent Repsol from meddling in their affairs.

Quote:
Besides the engineering dept won't actually build anything. They'll wirte specs and blueprints then farm out the actual manufacturing or construction to another vendor or internal manufacturing. thats what i do. and they can push those guys to the limit. if HRC told x company we need it tomorrow, do you really think they'd say no?
HRC's HQ in Japan does have production capabilities for one. Secondly you can't say 'we need it tomorrow' for a part that takes several days to CNC, especially when said part is made out of exotic metal. Some of the parts take several days to make in Moto GP, its not that simple.
G.Irish is offline  
post #12 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 09:06 AM
MotoGP NEWS Guru
 
sooperman12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,051
Images: 107
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoredTiger View Post
I think Nicky is a great rider. I just don't think he's championship material...YET.

He hasn't shown it. The season he won, to me, wasn't convincing or deserved.

I respect Nicky tremendously, and I really like his demeanor and how he looks at racing. I really respect this guy. A true professional. I don't doubt that he will be a great in MotoGP (after a few more championships). I just haven't seen CHAMPIONSHIP from him yet...that's all.
You're an idiot. Have you seen the last few races? Nicky has demonstrated time and time again that he's an elite rider. He's at least a top 5 in GP and I would DEFINITELY put him above Casey Stoner, skill-wise. Besides this year's GP championship, what has Casey won? Nothing. Hayden is top 5 of the top 3% of motorcycle racers in the sport.

Bernard
NESBA #12I
CBR1000RR8 (street)
CBR600RR5 (track)



"It´s not easier to ride, but I don´t need something easier, I need something faster."
- Nicky Hayden #69

Next Track Days (NESBA): September 10 - Summit (Main)
sooperman12 is offline  
post #13 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 09:16 AM
Moto GP Racer
 
Niner1000RR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Posts: 6,502
Thanks: 42
Thanked 223 Times in 189 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
ABSOLUTELY Soop!!!


"at 8k i often get the tire to slip a bit(kinda like stoner in motogp) when i start to get on the throttle"
Niner1000RR is offline  
post #14 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 09:55 AM
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacrilicious View Post
At least he got one championship while Repsol was still 100% behind him.
Repsol Honda were NEVER 100% behind him. They are a "spanish" team with their prized spanish rider(podbot) so he was always playing second fiddle. To me though that makes his 06 championship run all that more impressive. Hayden is alot better rider than most people would like to admit. He essentially makes himself the #1 rider even though the team has other plans.
VR46 is offline  
post #15 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 10:00 AM
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.Irish View Post
.... And don't even bring up that Repsol conspiracy theory nonsense. The money Repsol gives Honda is a drop in the bucket compared to what Honda spends in total for Moto GP. Honda sent Camel and Telefonica Movistar packing because they were making demands that conflicted with their interests, they surely don't give a damn if they have to do the same with Repsol. As a matter of fact, that's why HRC signed Dani directly rather than letting him sign a contract with Repsol. To prevent Repsol from meddling in their affairs.

Your right Honda does not need Repsols money but podbot is their #1 rider. Hence why the 800 was developed around him. I thought this was common knowledge?
VR46 is offline  
post #16 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 10:24 AM
Pocketbike Racer
 
Sacrilicious's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 420
Images: 1
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by VR46 View Post
Repsol Honda were NEVER 100% behind him. They are a "spanish" team with their prized spanish rider(podbot) so he was always playing second fiddle. To me though that makes his 06 championship run all that more impressive. Hayden is alot better rider than most people would like to admit. He essentially makes himself the #1 rider even though the team has other plans.
I agree with that, maybe I should have said, "behind him enough".

It's true that Nicky is getting more goodies at the end of the season, but it's way too late now. I'm happy he got a few podiums/etc though. He really is a top rider. I wonder where he'll go after Repsol.

It's too bad Pedrosa is worth so damn much to Repsol/Dorna. With the amount of money TVE pays for MotoGP coverage, and how Pedrosa's success relates to their viewer share, it's no wonder Pedrosa gets such a strong push from all angles.

03 RR
Sacrilicious is offline  
post #17 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 11:23 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 591
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by VR46 View Post
Your right Honda does not need Repsols money but podbot is their #1 rider. Hence why the 800 was developed around him. I thought this was common knowledge?
HRC developed the bike around Pedrosa's dimensions because HRC believes he has what it takes to be the next dominate champion. Not because he's Spanish and they have a Spanish sponsor. If HRC cared so much about pleasing Repsol with giving a Spanish rider preference they would have kicked Doohan off the team and let Criville win and they would have signed Toni Elias, Carlos Checa, or Sete Gibernau instead of Nicky Hayden to team with Pedrobot.

Pedrosa is there because of his skills, not his nationality. I think HRC was wrong to design the bike around a smaller rider like him but I don't that is necessarily why Hayden has done so poorly starting the season. Pretty much all of the Honda riders have done poorly this season because the bike did not handle particularly well, Dani-sized or not, Michelin has not been up to snuff, and they were down on power (in other words the bike didn't really do anything well). Once they started to address those issues lo and behold Nicky started to come back.
G.Irish is offline  
post #18 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 12:33 PM
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.Irish View Post
HRC developed the bike around Pedrosa's dimensions because HRC believes he has what it takes to be the next dominate champion. Not because he's Spanish and they have a Spanish sponsor. If HRC cared so much about pleasing Repsol with giving a Spanish rider preference they would have kicked Doohan off the team and let Criville win and they would have signed Toni Elias, Carlos Checa, or Sete Gibernau instead of Nicky Hayden to team with Pedrobot.

Pedrosa is there because of his skills, not his nationality. I think HRC was wrong to design the bike around a smaller rider like him but I don't that is necessarily why Hayden has done so poorly starting the season. Pretty much all of the Honda riders have done poorly this season because the bike did not handle particularly well, Dani-sized or not, Michelin has not been up to snuff, and they were down on power (in other words the bike didn't really do anything well). Once they started to address those issues lo and behold Nicky started to come back.
That’s right, they favor podbot. So we agree then? It can be spun however you want but the fact of the matter is Hayden was in the midst of a championship run last year and still podbot had the better bike, got the parts and was having the 08 bike designed for him. That says more about REPSOL Hondas intentions than I or anyone else could say. The Spanish have their “golden boy”, “the next big thing” or whatever you want to call him and they will back him accordingly. Kick Doohan and let Criville win? That’s just crazy talk and I’ll pretend you didn’t say that, you’re a lot smarter than that. There is not a better Spanish rider on the grid right now and im not saying podbot lacks skills. Hes a very good rider(weighing only 51kg helps too!!)



Yeah I’m not making excuses for Hayden. He rode pretty well this year considering. Honda was really weak in the beginning of the season and it would have been that way no matter who the bike was designed after. Everyone was trying to catch Ducati. I agree with you last paragraph 100% about the Hondas, they just didn’t have it this season. I just don’t like to see podbot favored when Hayden deserves it. He works his ass off and he shouldn’t have to be #2 on any team.




*just a quick note. On forums this is the point where a lot of conversations go down hill and people start name calling. Since I’m new here and don’t really know anyone yet can we keep things civil? Not saying you are like that but just pointing it out… its hard to have rational conversations on the internet most of the time
VR46 is offline  
post #19 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 01:55 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 591
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by VR46 View Post
That’s right, they favor podbot. So we agree then? It can be spun however you want but the fact of the matter is Hayden was in the midst of a championship run last year and still podbot had the better bike, got the parts and was having the 08 bike designed for him. That says more about REPSOL Hondas intentions than I or anyone else could say.

The thing about Pedrosa having 'the better bike' last year is that if the roles were reversed (Dani on the Evo RCV and Nicky on the standard RCV) people would've complained that Pedrosa was getting all the parts and poor ol' Nicky was stuck with the old bike. Nicky and company have said in some ways the Evo was an advantage over the standard bike and he won the championship on it so the bike could not have been that bad at the end. Here's a quote directly from Nicky's crew chief's mouth:

Quote:
So it must've been supremely satisfying for you that you and Nicky took the Evolution RC211V3, a bike that nobody really wanted to ride, and you turned it into a championship contender. Obviously winning a championship is a big career moment for you but was it extra special doing it on a bike that people didn't think you could win on?
Yeah it was. In some ways that bike really suited Nicky's style, or certain facets of it really suited Nicky's style which is why we went that direction last year. And it was, it was very frustrating, a lot more hard work than you really wanted. But at the end of the day like you say we got the results and that's all that mattered.
Quote:
The Spanish have their “golden boy”, “the next big thing” or whatever you want to call him and they will back him accordingly. Kick Doohan and let Criville win? That’s just crazy talk and I’ll pretend you didn’t say that, you’re a lot smarter than that. There is not a better Spanish rider on the grid right now and im not saying podbot lacks skills. Hes a very good rider(weighing only 51kg helps too!!)

I'm not saying anyone should've gotten rid of Doohan, I'm saying that plenty of times in the past Repsol Honda could have favored or selected a Spanish rider but did not. I just don't think nationality matters that much to HRC unless its a Japanese rider, and even then, said Japanese rider has to be fast.

Quote:
Yeah I’m not making excuses for Hayden. He rode pretty well this year considering. Honda was really weak in the beginning of the season and it would have been that way no matter who the bike was designed after. Everyone was trying to catch Ducati. I agree with you last paragraph 100% about the Hondas, they just didn’t have it this season. I just don’t like to see podbot favored when Hayden deserves it. He works his ass off and he shouldn’t have to be #2 on any team.

I think it was wrong for HRC to develop the RC212V around a smaller rider with Dani Pedrosa in mind, and to wit, the lead designer of the RC212V got moved out of HRC back into the production side (whether that was part of the normal rotation or the price of failure I don't know).

After the season started though it was Hayden's job to outperform Dani. During the season the way HRC has always worked is that the rider getting the best results gets the parts either first or at the same time as the other rider. Thus far it seems like Hayden has been getting the updates right there with Pedrosa. His results have improved accordingly.



Last edited by G.Irish; 10-18-2007 at 01:58 PM.
G.Irish is offline  
post #20 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 02:30 PM
MotoGP NEWS Guru
 
sooperman12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,051
Images: 107
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Remember, too, that a lot of the spreading around of upgrades happened faster after the HRC CEO was let go and a new CEO was put in place. I think he was there from the Spain until now. He was definitely on hand at Motegi to make sure that Dani was signed. But yeah, he wasn't happy when Hayden's bike exploded down the straight a few races back, spewing oil and coolant everywhere. He probably wasn't happy when Hayden's bike chunked itself in PI hunting down Stoner. Mind you, Hayden was the only rider able to stay on Stoner's back wheel.

Bernard
NESBA #12I
CBR1000RR8 (street)
CBR600RR5 (track)



"It´s not easier to ride, but I don´t need something easier, I need something faster."
- Nicky Hayden #69

Next Track Days (NESBA): September 10 - Summit (Main)
sooperman12 is offline  
post #21 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 08:06 PM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
BoredTiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 895
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12 View Post
You're an idiot. Have you seen the last few races? Nicky has demonstrated time and time again that he's an elite rider. He's at least a top 5 in GP and I would DEFINITELY put him above Casey Stoner, skill-wise. Besides this year's GP championship, what has Casey won? Nothing. Hayden is top 5 of the top 3% of motorcycle racers in the sport.
I've seen all the races this year and last.

I already said, Nicky is an amazing rider. I don't question his skill as a GP rider, as he's shown, when he's competitive, he can really carve up the track (unless his bike is not behaving or his teammate or at time his countryman decides to wipe him out).

As for being an idiot, you're an idiot. How's that?

I would not discount Casey Stoner's skill this year, and jump to the conclusion that he's inferior than Nicky, when Casey has displayed a far superior overall season in both wet and dry conditions, than Nicky ever did in last year's championship.

Casey has had a far more dominant season than Nicky and his points total proves it.

You're obviously a huge Nicky Hayden fan, and that's great for you.

I said it before, I have great respect for Nicky Hayden, and I truly believe if Honda focused on Nicky, they'd be far better off than building around Pedrosa.

Again, Nicky has yet to show he's championship material. If you insist that he is, how many podiums has he had? How many podiums has Pedrosa had? How many 1st place finishes has Nicky had this season, in his defending season? Where is he in the points total?

Results don't lie.

I'm sure when everything gets sorted out for Nicky, he can win more races and get to the podium more frequently. I would even think that he could do better on another manufacturer's bike. Who knows...

In any case, Nicky is not championship material at the moment.

2007 CBR600RR Black/Silver
BoredTiger is offline  
post #22 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 09:55 PM
MotoGP NEWS Guru
 
sooperman12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,051
Images: 107
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoredTiger View Post
I've seen all the races this year and last.

I already said, Nicky is an amazing rider. I don't question his skill as a GP rider, as he's shown, when he's competitive, he can really carve up the track (unless his bike is not behaving or his teammate or at time his countryman decides to wipe him out).

As for being an idiot, you're an idiot. How's that?

I would not discount Casey Stoner's skill this year, and jump to the conclusion that he's inferior than Nicky, when Casey has displayed a far superior overall season in both wet and dry conditions, than Nicky ever did in last year's championship.

Casey has had a far more dominant season than Nicky and his points total proves it.

You're obviously a huge Nicky Hayden fan, and that's great for you.

I said it before, I have great respect for Nicky Hayden, and I truly believe if Honda focused on Nicky, they'd be far better off than building around Pedrosa.

Again, Nicky has yet to show he's championship material. If you insist that he is, how many podiums has he had? How many podiums has Pedrosa had? How many 1st place finishes has Nicky had this season, in his defending season? Where is he in the points total?

Results don't lie.

I'm sure when everything gets sorted out for Nicky, he can win more races and get to the podium more frequently. I would even think that he could do better on another manufacturer's bike. Who knows...

In any case, Nicky is not championship material at the moment.
You're still an idiot. Nicky's not championship material? Where's the respect there bro? You're right results don't lie...

# of World Championships by Casey Stoner: 1
# of World Championships by Nicky Hayden: 1

And that's just in GP... # of Championships by Nicky: 3 (GP, AMA SBK, AMA SS)

# of Championships for Casey:... still 1.

You're right. Results DON'T lie. Nicky IS championship material because he's proven it on different levels. Casey Stoner has been racing the world circuit since 2001 (7 years); he's got 33 podiums total.

Nicky's been on the world circuit for since 2003 (5 years) and has 23 podiums total. Give Nicky a couple more years, I'm sure he'll match or surpass that.

And before I finish... You're right. I'm a HUGE Nicky fan, but not just because he's an excellent rider, but because he's humble. He doesn't talk crap about any other rider. And he was the FIRST to topple Rossi and do it graciously...

A champion means more than just winning a bunch of races, but he's done that too in his lifetime.

Bernard
NESBA #12I
CBR1000RR8 (street)
CBR600RR5 (track)



"It´s not easier to ride, but I don´t need something easier, I need something faster."
- Nicky Hayden #69

Next Track Days (NESBA): September 10 - Summit (Main)
sooperman12 is offline  
post #23 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 10:31 PM
Pocketbike Racer
 
GrdnRR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 384
Images: 16
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12 View Post
You're an idiot. Have you seen the last few races? Nicky has demonstrated time and time again that he's an elite rider. He's at least a top 5 in GP and I would DEFINITELY put him above Casey Stoner, skill-wise. Besides this year's GP championship, what has Casey won? Nothing. Hayden is top 5 of the top 3% of motorcycle racers in the sport.

Thank you Soop!! Some people just fluff theirselves too hard; you think you can criticize a champ?

Sorry mang for the hatin but Nicky earned and deserves every single oz. of the championship
GrdnRR is offline  
post #24 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 01:11 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
BoredTiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 895
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12 View Post
You're still an idiot. Nicky's not championship material? Where's the respect there bro? You're right results don't lie...

# of World Championships by Casey Stoner: 1
# of World Championships by Nicky Hayden: 1

And that's just in GP... # of Championships by Nicky: 3 (GP, AMA SBK, AMA SS)

# of Championships for Casey:... still 1.

You're right. Results DON'T lie. Nicky IS championship material because he's proven it on different levels. Casey Stoner has been racing the world circuit since 2001 (7 years); he's got 33 podiums total.

Nicky's been on the world circuit for since 2003 (5 years) and has 23 podiums total. Give Nicky a couple more years, I'm sure he'll match or surpass that.

And before I finish... You're right. I'm a HUGE Nicky fan, but not just because he's an excellent rider, but because he's humble. He doesn't talk crap about any other rider. And he was the FIRST to topple Rossi and do it graciously...

A champion means more than just winning a bunch of races, but he's done that too in his lifetime.

I'm not a huge Nicky fan, but I will be the first to admit that Nicky Hayden is one of the classiest and humblest riders out there. EVERY interview I've listened to/read about him he's been nothing but polite and courteous and very modest.

That is where my respect for him mainly lies. His championship last year to me was not exciting, not impressive and not championship racing. His points total showed it. Again, results don't lie.

I'm not a Stoner fan, but Stoner's championship season has been far superior to any single season of Nicky's in the GP class. So, I'm not sure why you're bringing in his other racing credentials (Hayden's). I'm talking MOTOGP championship material. Nothing else.

I believe that once Nicky has a good machine, and a team/factory that properly supports him, he will be a force to be reckoned with, THROUGHOUT an entire season. Not a race here and there.

If you're trying to convince me or anyone else that he's had an impressive season this year, you're out of your mind. If you're trying to tell me that he's a worthy MotoGP champion, you got your work cut out for you.

It's one thing to be a fan of the guy, it's another to be completely deluded and homer-ish.

As for toppling Rossi? Please, give me a break.

Since you think spewing numbers supports your losing argument, here are some numbers for you to acknowledge:

Valentino Rossi (2006) - 17 Races, 5 wins, 10 podiums, 5 poles, 247 pts (season).

Casey Stoner (2007 in progress) - 16 Races, 9 wins, 12 podiums, 5 poles, 322 pts (two races remaining)

Nicky Hayden (2006 Championship season) - 17 races, 2 wins, 10 podiums, 1 pole, 252 pts. (won the championship by only 5 pts.


So...how is Nicky Hayden championship worthy with 2 wins in his championship season? One pole? Give me a break. ANYONE who watched last season knows that 2006 was Rossi's to lose. His various mechanical problems and unfortunate crash/down in Valencia cost him the championship. NOT Hayden's racing.



Topple Rossi? You're out of your mind.

Let's look at Rossi's numbers in ALL his winning seasons from 2001-2005. That's 5 consecutive seasons of winning in the TOP class. What was his LOWEST win total in any of those seasons? 9. 9 races MINIMUM he won to earn his championship title, pedigree, and supremacy.

Topple Rossi?

Rossi (2007) - 14 races, 4 wins, 8 podiums, 214 pts (2nd place)

Hayden (2007) - 13 races, 0 wins, 3 podiums, 112 pts (9th place)


It's one thing to be a fan of a rider, it's something else to be completely retarded.

2007 CBR600RR Black/Silver
BoredTiger is offline  
post #25 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 07:42 AM
MotoGP NEWS Guru
 
sooperman12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,051
Images: 107
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoredTiger View Post
His points total showed it. Again, results don't lie.

So...how is Nicky Hayden championship worthy with 2 wins in his championship season? One pole? Give me a break. ANYONE who watched last season knows that 2006 was Rossi's to lose. His various mechanical problems and unfortunate crash/down in Valencia cost him the championship. NOT Hayden's racing.

Topple Rossi? You're out of your mind.
Well, shoot, if you put it that way. If Rossi didn't have that crash in Germany and the fact that his Michelin tires crapped out on him and his M1 imploding on itself, then Casey Stoner wouldn't be the World Champion either huh?

Let's keep playing the what if's since you like doing that... What if Nicky's bike last year didn't have clutch problems throughout the year, how many more podiums and victories might he have?

What if, in 2007, HRC, actually gave him what he was asking for instead of waiting until Catalunya to do that? Where would he be? What if Hayden's bike didn't chunk itself last weekend?

You see, your argument is weak because you're just asking a bunch of "what if's". All you need to know is Nicky had 252 points and SECOND place Rossi had 247.

Now, I understand it's your opinion that he's not worthy. And that's your opinion. But since your opinion is not based on fact, you're an idiot. Hayden is MOTOGP CHAMPIONSHIP MATERIAL because he was the 2006 MOTOGP CHAMPION. That's the fact.

So, in your logic, you would say that Alex Criville isn't championship material because he was champion once and only because Doohan's career ended?

You don't think Kenny Roberts, Jr. is championship material?

The great Kevin Schwantz? He only has 1 title. And he did it with only 4 victories.

You see, there's no point in criticizing riders who have already proved themselves to be champions by winning the championship. It just makes you sound like you could do better. There's not going to be another V.Rossi. And you know what, when the other manufacturers catch up and Michelin starts doing their job, you're going to see a HUGE reversal of fortunes for Casey Stoner. In fact, I think Dani Pedrosa fills in the boots that were made for him and he dominates next year.

Again, Hayden is a top 5 rider, up there with Rossi, Dani, Melandri and Stoner. You put anyone of those guys on a Ducati shod with Bridgestones and put Stoner on a Honda or a Yamaha, and it would look starkly different. You don't go from Crash King one year to WC the next unless some things are working hugely in your favor.

Bernard
NESBA #12I
CBR1000RR8 (street)
CBR600RR5 (track)



"It´s not easier to ride, but I don´t need something easier, I need something faster."
- Nicky Hayden #69

Next Track Days (NESBA): September 10 - Summit (Main)

Last edited by sooperman12; 10-19-2007 at 07:47 AM.
sooperman12 is offline  
post #26 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 08:03 AM
Moto GP Racer
 
OveRReV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Islas de Filipinas
Posts: 6,774
Images: 16
Thanks: 407
Thanked 396 Times in 337 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
hehehe Ducati accelerated their TC development a thousand fold b'coz they knew it's the crasher king's only chance to stay up, it goes something like this, instead of doubling the budget for fairings why don't we put the money into developing better riding aids (TC) so that we minimize crashing or eliminate it.

it worked for them like a charm, full lean WOT on a wet track, what do you know.... no crash. :D


2003 CBR 600RR JDM
HRC ECU AMA spec
HRC radiator
Electrex World race alternator
WP 4618 rear shock
WP 1508 steering damper
Ohlins 9.0N fork springs
Overrev tuned fork cartridges
Akrapovic Evo Carbon FS
Dynojet PCV WB2 POD300
BMC race air filter
AFAM 15/47 sprockets
DID VX2 520 gold chain
Brembo 19RCS MC
HEL brakelines
Euro Racing riser plates & lever
HM Plus quickshifter
EVR CTS slipper clutch
BST CF wheels
OveRReV is offline  
post #27 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 08:14 AM
MotoGP NEWS Guru
 
sooperman12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,051
Images: 107
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by OveRReV View Post
hehehe Ducati accelerated their TC development a thousand fold b'coz they knew it's the crasher king's only chance to stay up, it goes something like this, instead of doubling the budget for fairings why don't we put the money into developing better riding aids (TC) so that we minimize crashing or eliminate it.

it worked for them like a charm, full lean WOT on a wet track, what do you know.... no crash. :D
Casey Stoner will be the first to admit that TC has helped him stay on two. I remember one interview where he said, he thanked traction control because his right hand didn't dial in the right input and it got squirrely on him. While I believe that Traction Control helped Stoner out a bunch, it also has a lot to do with the amazing front tire Bridgestone has. Of all the people who've tucked the front this year, they've been Michelin runners. But yeah, Magneti Marelli TC + Bridgestone tires = great bike!

Bernard
NESBA #12I
CBR1000RR8 (street)
CBR600RR5 (track)



"It´s not easier to ride, but I don´t need something easier, I need something faster."
- Nicky Hayden #69

Next Track Days (NESBA): September 10 - Summit (Main)
sooperman12 is offline  
post #28 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 08:30 AM
Hittin The Twisties On My RC 51
 
600RRyder1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,196
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Wow, you guys sure know your MotoGP. I just like seeing the bikes go around the track. I guess I should know more about the stuff behind the scenes.



Beauty and The Beast

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssgmack View Post

In the end the lesson is: kill everyone you see.
600RRyder1 is offline  
post #29 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 08:41 AM
Pocketbike Racer
 
Sacrilicious's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 420
Images: 1
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12 View Post
You don't go from Crash King one year to WC the next unless some things are working hugely in your favor.
Who was it that said "When you get married, you lose a second" and 1 second per kid etc?

Maybe Stoner just needed to lose that 1 second to stay on the track. =)

He's always done very well in the past... before he crashed.

03 RR
Sacrilicious is offline  
post #30 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 08:51 AM
AMA Supersport Racer
 
BoredTiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 895
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sooperman12 View Post
Well, shoot, if you put it that way. If Rossi didn't have that crash in Germany and the fact that his Michelin tires crapped out on him and his M1 imploding on itself, then Casey Stoner wouldn't be the World Champion either huh?

Let's keep playing the what if's since you like doing that... What if Nicky's bike last year didn't have clutch problems throughout the year, how many more podiums and victories might he have?

What if, in 2007, HRC, actually gave him what he was asking for instead of waiting until Catalunya to do that? Where would he be? What if Hayden's bike didn't chunk itself last weekend?

You see, your argument is weak because you're just asking a bunch of "what if's". All you need to know is Nicky had 252 points and SECOND place Rossi had 247.

Now, I understand it's your opinion that he's not worthy. And that's your opinion. But since your opinion is not based on fact, you're an idiot. Hayden is MOTOGP CHAMPIONSHIP MATERIAL because he was the 2006 MOTOGP CHAMPION. That's the fact.

So, in your logic, you would say that Alex Criville isn't championship material because he was champion once and only because Doohan's career ended?

You don't think Kenny Roberts, Jr. is championship material?

The great Kevin Schwantz? He only has 1 title. And he did it with only 4 victories.

You see, there's no point in criticizing riders who have already proved themselves to be champions by winning the championship. It just makes you sound like you could do better. There's not going to be another V.Rossi. And you know what, when the other manufacturers catch up and Michelin starts doing their job, you're going to see a HUGE reversal of fortunes for Casey Stoner. In fact, I think Dani Pedrosa fills in the boots that were made for him and he dominates next year.

Again, Hayden is a top 5 rider, up there with Rossi, Dani, Melandri and Stoner. You put anyone of those guys on a Ducati shod with Bridgestones and put Stoner on a Honda or a Yamaha, and it would look starkly different. You don't go from Crash King one year to WC the next unless some things are working hugely in your favor.
Touche on the Doohan and Schwantz references. How about Rainey? Or...how about Spencer? Can't forget KR (the winner). Or the late Barry Sheene. Quite a generation gap...

I completely agree that had Stoner did NOT have the current bike and factory support, he'd be slipping and sliding and crashing all over the place, as he did so reliably last season and seasons before.

Regarding Casey Stoner being champion this year, I think it would have been far more competitive in terms of points, had Rossi's machine and tires been more....competitive. Who knows what Pedrosa would have been able to do?

Hayden won the Championship in 2006, that's all done and over with. Like you said, it's my opinion that I don't see Hayden as being a full-fledged Champion, compared to his peers. It's too bad he's racing while Rossi is, because that's quite a shadow to come out of.

If we want to time travel and start racing the older 500ccs and what not, I'm not exactly sure how riders like Nicky, Casey, Dani would do. The older bikes were entirely different beasts. So, I'd like to keep the generations gaps.

The modern MotoGP racing class has a heavy emphasis on electronics.

How well these riders can adapt with (or vice/versa) their machines will determine who can perform, week in, week out. Of course rider skill is paramount, but that's given. This is MotoGP. The top class.


You seem to think, all because I don't think Nicky earned his championship, that I'm dumping on him. I'm certain if you asked Hayden if he would prefer to have done better in 2006, he would say "Hell Yes!"

That being said, I know the "Kid" can do better. I've seen him race like a bat out of hell in various GP races. In races, I know he'd dominate in, he's had some serious bad luck (e.g. thank you John Hopkins at Laguna Seca). In Australia, he was looking to kick Stoner's ass...but alas...more bad luck.


You're probably right, that there will not be another V. Rossi in the near future. In that regard, everyone has a chance at being a MotoGP champion. But in this day and age, with Rossi in the mix, and Stoner winning races, riders like Hayden really have to step it up.

Rossi battled all sorts of problems this season and still managed to stay in contention for the most part. Even if Rossi didn't crash, in races where he was close to Stoner (e.g. Shanghai) it was clear that the Ducati machine was superior and that Stoner really rode the hell out of the bike.


So yes, an argument can be made that if Stoner didn't have the Ducati, he wouldn't win, but what about Pramac riders, Loris Capirossi? They're riding Ducati's shod with Bridgestones. Why aren't they all in the top 5?


HOPEFULLY, next year's tire regulation rule will make more sense and the tires won't be so important. That way the racing can be brought back to the riders and machines and not rubber/compounds.


As for supposing that I can do better myself...I laugh at that notion. IF I could ever ride like ANY of these people, I would not be posting in forums. I'd be in riding heaven.


Between stating my observations and opinions, you're the initiator of insults. So I'm not sure what your problem is.

In any other sport, if you crowned someone a champion and lauded him/her for that achievement, amidst a career (context) of not-so-championship like performance, the person would be embarassed.

Granted Hayden made improvements through his MotoGP career, but in my eyes, with the kind of racing the current riders are racing, a champion needs to be on/near or over 300 points. Again, that's my opinion.



In any case, I intend to continue to enjoy the last two races in Sepang and Valencia and look forward to seeing some exciting racing.


It's quite obvious you're a huge fan of the sport, you race yourself, and you're also a big follower of Nicky Hayden. That's great! It's what the sport needs, and hopefully more Americans will embrace this sport as passionately as you.

With the Indy race next season, coupled with Laguna Seca, I really hope that MotoGP captures the attention of the American public. Riders like Nicky Hayden, Colin Edwards, John Hopkins will have to shine and give the nation someone to root for. Out of those three right there, I would say Nicky will achieve more by the end of his career.

2007 CBR600RR Black/Silver
BoredTiger is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the 600RR.net forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome